[7th Sea] [Request] [Commission] A functional Roll & Keep character sheet.

Hi guys. I'm starting a 7th Sea campaign in the near future - and would love to have a character sheet that let my players combine attributes with skills, and roll them in a formula that in normal macro speek would look like this: /roll xd10ky!! I've looked into modifying the L5R sheet briefly (they share the same core system) and saw a lot of lines of stuff I didn't even begin to comprehend. This is probably a good time to point out I'm not super good with these things. Hopefully, that's where you come in. If you look at these sheets and have a pretty good idea of what's going on there - You're way ahead of me. If you also know the R&K system, all the better - but if not, I'd be happy to tell you what buttons I want, and what I want to happen when people click them. I'd even be happy to tell you what I want things to look like. Now, I realize that this stuff takes time that you could probably be spending better than helping a stranger out with a game almost nobody plays any more, and I'm not asking you to do it for free. I'm a bit out of my depth about how many hours of work writing a functional character sheet will take, but to my understanding you can adapt some of the ones out there. If you're willing to work with me, and offer me some support and tweaks further down the line, I'd be happy to compensate you 50-100€ for the effort, depending on how much time it'll take you to make the code do your (and thus my) bidding. If you're interested, please contact me by PM and we'll work something out. Kind regards, -Niki

I can take a look, in a bit (this afternoon to tomorrow). Since I already set a precedence, if I'm to do the work, you are asked to donate any money to roll20. But I'm tired today, and waiting for coffee to kick in. So I can't promise anything.

Be happy to throw support their way John. The way I see it, funding an extra sheet up on github helps 'm anyway :).

Just a small bump. Still looking for a volunteer to help me out with this. Help your fellow PC illiterate Pen and paper enthusiasts out. Get paid in the process.

I just got freed up, so I'll take a look, unless some one else jumps on it.

Usually it's better if someone who's familiar with the system makes a sheet.

Ken L. said: Usually it's better if someone who's familiar with the system makes a sheet. If yer volunteering, go for it. I'm just lending hand,

I tried to make a custom sheet for a friend who was running a special version of dungeon world. In the end I kinda gave up since there was too much back-and-forth and we ended up using the one by Will with modifications he ended up doing himself. It's hard to make things for something that's unfamiliar. It's cool if you're up for it, just saying it might be tricky to pin what feels right. Kinda like someone from the NFL designing an App for FIFA.

I do appreciate the help :). Finding someone familiar with both 7th Sea and the code might be a tall order to fill; I'd be happy to give a pretty good description of what I'd like it to be able to do to do. Honestly - If you allow me to sorta info dump on you, or have a quick Q&A on skype (if my internet's up for it - might have to be in chat otherwise. I'm in rural China) I'd be happy to give you the freedom to use your own sense of aesthetic and convenience. It's not an incredibly strange system, and I'll be more than happy to have automated skill rolls. If it also tracks wounds all the better. If it somehow communicates the initiative system (which will be the most complex thing) - I'd be in heaven; but I don't expect this. In short - for me to learn how to do it while working on it likely take me far longer than someone who knows what's going on. This, for whatever reason, doesn't extend to me trying to fix things around the house - and results in the girlfriend calling plumbers behind my back. Would it help if I posted a quick system / expectation breakdown in the public thread?

Or PM me. Better yet; let me get the basic down first- should have it by Fridays after noon (my time)- and I'll throw it on a campign so you can see it. Then you can bash it around, punch holes in it, and tell me what I did wrong and how to fix it.

Sounds great John - Much obliged :).

Here is the game. If you are using Chrome, hit the shield in the button in the http bar to let the font load. Still reading up on how the rolls are made to determine how the buttons will work

I'm digging the aesthetic, for sure John. The "Action Dice" tab looks fantastic, and if that makes initiative work automaggically I'd be in heaven. Keep in mind that most of my enemies won't have full cahracter sheets, so I need a way to quickly, manually assign them initiative / action dice as well (but that might not be an issue at all, I have no idea what's going on under the hood). If it lets players quickly combine a trait + knack I call for that'd be great. (Say, Finesse 2 + Attack 3 would read as /roll 5d10k2!! ), and if a knack would also store a "default" attribute (finesse for attack, for example) it'd be perfect. Basically, a single click for for rolling a knack + the attribute it's linked to most often - but still making it possible to combine knacks and attributes on the fly. I must say I'm pretty impressed with what you cooked up so far; Can I ask how long it took you?

I love that character sheet John, it makes me want to play straight 7th Sea rather than the amalgamation our campaign has evolved into. Thought regarding the rolls... In 7th Sea knacks are *usually* used with the same corresponding attribute each time you use them (i.e. Fencing almost always goes with Finesse, First Aid with Wits, etc). It's kind of up to the GM but I tend to allow players to use knacks with different attributes for different uses (i.e Fencing and Finesse for attack, Fencing and Wits for discussing the finer points of the art, identify whether a sword is a suitable weapon or just for show or maybe to recognise a fighting style). My personal choice would be for each knack have two buttons next to them - one would do the most common roll with the 'default' attribute, and the other would prompt for an attribute. So each knack line would look something like: [ Knack Text Box ] [ Att Dropdown ] O O O O O O [ Roll ] [ Alt. Roll ] EDIT (to replace ASCII art...) And now I shall end my interruption and go back to hiding.

I'd say that's exactly what I wanted to describe, but worded a lot better. Thanks, Ben!

Oh and just to clarify the roll as per the rules (Roll Trait+Skill, Keep Trait) would essentially be: /roll [[@{attribute}+@{knack}]]d10k[[@{attribute}]]!! With attribute and knack replaced with the corresponding attribute and knack.

Thanks for the input. I am very pleased you like what I got thus far. I'm not sure how to make the initiative work like its described in the book. It might take some API scripts, which I'm not spun up on. But I plan on having a total feature, so you can break ties. The skills...the drop down menu is a good idea. I'll put that into the works. Since the 'alt' button would need the attribute twice (once to add to the number of dice rolled, and once for the number of dice kept), it may be smoother just to have the single button, and select each attribute as you go. But, we'll see. Anyhow, thanks again forth input. I'll see what I can do. And it took a day or so, with a few games of Borderlands 2 spread between it.

A dropdown and single button would work, can set it and just change it on the odd occasion when you're using a non-standard trait. Initiative is both the most convoluted and single greatest mechnic in 7th Sea, I haven't really looked into doing API stuff but I suppose in theory you could do something to the effect of: for (x=0; x<@{panache}; x++) { addToInitiative(name=@{name}, value=1d10) } I guess you'd have to do some sort of sorting to deal with characters acting in the same phase. Probably beyond the scope of the character sheet at this stage anyway.

Just checked back and saw it overhauled quite a bit already. Fast work, John :). I was toying with it a little, and noticed that it rolls the dice - but if they explode, it doesn't add them as a single die to keep. What I mean is (and it should still be in the log) when I rolled a Finesse 2, Stabby 5 - it did roll 7 dice and kept 2. Some dice rolled 10 however, which means after exploding they have a value higher than 10, but only count as a single die to keep - while the sheet as currently coded will only keep 2 10's - basically capping out at 20. It was pointed out to me that the /roll macro to get around that was using double exclamation marks. One last thing is that is might also be useful to have the ability to add a quick modifier to the roll? 7th Sea often uses "raises", which basically means the total +5. It's extremely rare to get more than 2 of these free raises, so either a free field where a player could type a numeral, or 1 or 2 checkboxes adding 5 to the total could work. Looking really neat so far though - thanks!

Thanks for the tip on the "!!". I was wondering how to get around the issue. I plan on putting a modifier in most rolls. Are there any rolls that won't get the modifier?

In theory any skill/trait rolls can get free raises. Initiative rolls generally don't but they work very differently. Just to throw another spanner in the mix, unskilled rolls don't explode and if you have suffered Dramatic Wounds equal to or greater than your Resolve then no skill rolls will explode. Can you do if statements or conditionals on buttons? Something like: if @{knack} = 0 or @{dramaticwounds} => @{resolve} then /roll [[@{attribute}+@{knack}]]d10k[[@{attribute}]] else /roll [[@{attribute}+@{knack}]]d10k[[@{attribute}]]!! end if I guess the alternative would be some sort of 'Unskilled Roll' button.

No if/then statements. I think there are work around methods using API, but I don't know API. I can put an unskilled button in. Speaking of wounds; I haven't read that far in the rules; does a simple number box work for tracking wounds?

Mostly done, I think. I am trying to put together some roll templates, especially for initiative. But, I'm having some problems .

If rolling unskilled - it'd always be a pure trait roll; so that's likely where they belong. It's not the end of the world, a non exploding D10 roll that uses only the attribute is basically no more than "/roll &lt;attribute&gt;d10. Easy to ask for on the fly using the die-roller. If it can be on the characeter sheet and not be a pain (or like.. non pretty!) by all means of course :). For my campaign, it probably won't come up quite that often, I houseruled quite some hefty skill changes (over here if you're curious <a href="http://www.guildofsanmarcos.net/phpbb/viewtopic.ph" rel="nofollow">http://www.guildofsanmarcos.net/phpbb/viewtopic.ph</a>... ). I'm still looking for feedback on those before I subject my players to them ;-). And good point about crippled, forgot about that! Again, I'm worthless in coding; But just a checkbox somewhere to label the character as crippled (automated based on resolve is nice, but if a character takes certain advantages - I wouldn't know where to go in the code to uncripple him) might be more versatile? Basically - when box is checked, dice won't explode? Can that be done? As to wounds; It's complicated y0. A character takes a number of flesh wounds , then rolls a soak roll which is brawn + misc (keep brawn + sometimes misc). If the result is equal to or higher than the total flesh wounds no problem and smooth sailing. Once the roll fails, the flesh wounds fall back to 0 - but the character takes a dramatic wound , of which he can take a number equal to resolve before becoming crippled (leading to the detailed above dice no longer exploding). Once the character takes twice his resolve in dramatic wounds - that's all she wrote. Hope that helps!

Beat me to posting!

I may pilfer some of your house rules. I actually like having lots of passive defences and I use Rolling for prone characters to act as a bit of a counter to Corps a Corps; I like the idea of skills like Pommel Strike reducing defence by a set amount rather than dropping it to 5 and I do something similar to you with reputation (Fame and Infamy). Other than that I have completely reworked skills to be more like L5R and other skill based systems - essentially each knack is a separate thing that characters buy and level up rather than buying skills and gaining a group of (sometimes seemingly random) knacks. &lt;/offtopic&gt; Having a crippled status or tick box does make more sense than basing it directly on Resolve, I hadn't considered advantages and school techniques that modify when you become crippled. With regards to Flesh Wounds and Dramatic Wounds, I'd simply have something like this: When you click the button it would set Flesh Wounds to 0 and increase Dramatic Wounds by 1. You'd really need to do it manually, any comparison against a roll is going to be flawed because you gain a variable number of dramatic wounds depending on how much you fail the roll by and what type of weapon was used (ie. you fail your Brawn roll by 16, if you were just stabbed you would take 1 dramatic wound, if you were shot with a gunpowder weapon you'd take 2, if you were caught in an explosion you'd take 3); just clicking the button a couple of times seems the easier option.

Dunno is I do the "reset this stat" with a button on the character sheet. I have updated the sheet with: Current defense radio button & display Changed "Unskilled" to "Crippled" Crippled block now auto calculates, and includes a modifier Knocked-Out block now auto calculates, and includes a modifier Wound Check is now a button that rolls Brawn and a modifier, keeping Brawn (this may be incorrect, now that I think about it) Static modifiers added to attack and damage of weapons Things to to: Move Swordsman school and Sorcerer Heritage to skill tab done Include dice roll and trait select to Swordsman school and Sorcerer Heritage done sell family members for profit done! they escaped and came back; I had to return the money figure out initiative button a bash-tastic method currently installed; very un-pretty roll templates for attack , defense, and skills

Other than that I have completely reworked skills to be more like L5R and other skill based systems - essentially each knack is a separate thing that characters buy and level up rather than buying skills and gaining a group of (sometimes seemingly random) knacks. &lt;/offtopic&gt; That's similar to what I'm hoping to accomplish with my own changes to skills actually - reduce bloat; and let players build what they want and not be limited by the skill groupings. "Oh, all our social characters are fashion experts. What a coincidence". I thought about adapting L5R, since it had a few more editions based on the same 'core" - but unfamiliarity with it kept me from it. I'd be rather interested in taking a look at your houserules, if you have 'm neatly compiled somewhere, actually. Anyways, I agree that that's not really for this thread. Take it to PM? -- I had a pretty great skype convo with John earlier, which resulted in the above checklist - which I'm pretty happy with. I didn't have anything to do with his family members being sold into slavery though, I take my hands off there :). I feel a bit lazy sitting back here and having you two talk code at each other for what's essentially my project - so let me just again express that I appreciate it and if I can do anything (except remind you that I'd be happy to offer compensation) - just let me know :).

I'll PM you my random chain of thoughts about house rules. John is doing all the work, I'm just curious about things since it's a system I'm familiar with and although I know HTML/CSS I have no idea what the character sheet system is actually capable of in Roll20. Basically I'm just sticking my nose in ;). Crippled block now auto calculates, and includes a modifier / Knocked-Out block now auto calculates, and includes a modifier With hindsight this is a really obvious but effective way of doing it. Wound Check is now a button that rolls Brawn and a modifier, keeping Brawn (this may be incorrect, now that I think about it) A normal wound check is just roll Brawn keep Brawn, if you've essentially made it Roll Brawn+X Keep Brawn then I think you've probably accounted for 99% of the school/advantage specific variations. I don't know of any off the top of my head but it's possible that there may be a few that let you keep extra dice or add a static modifier to the total - unless Niki can confirm that this is the case it's probably overkill to have the extra modifier boxes in the sheet though (I guess theoretically something like (@{Brawn}+@{rollmod})d10k(@{Brawn}+@{keepmod}) + @{staticmod} would account for every conceivable variation). sell family members for profit done! Always a good way to line your pocket. figure out initiative button Good luck!

Wound Check is now a button that rolls Brawn and a modifier, keeping Brawn (this may be incorrect, now that I think about it)A normal wound check is just roll Brawn keep Brawn, if you've essentially made it Roll Brawn+X Keep Brawn then I think you've probably accounted for 99% of the school/advantage specific variations. I don't know of any off the top of my head but it's possible that there may be a few that let you keep extra dice or add a static modifier to the total Toughness lets you add 1 kept die to your brawn! And I think there's an Ussuran/Vesten swordsman school that gives you a modifier on soaking? Can't remember offhand and don't have the books handy here. Anyways, I should be hitting the hay, it's late here where the sun rises.

John W. said: Things to to: Move Swordsman school and Sorcerer Heritage to skill tab done Include dice roll and trait select to Swordsman school and Sorcerer Heritage done sell family members for profit done! they escaped and came back; I had to return the money figure out initiative button a bash-tastic method currently installed; very un-pretty roll templates for attack , defense, and skills

Cool! Job's making me ... do things, but I'll check it in a few hours! :)

Following, though I can't seem to actually see the Char. Sheet everyone is referring to...

John W. said: Here is the game. If you are using Chrome, hit the shield in the button in the http bar to let the font load. Still reading up on how the rolls are made to determine how the buttons will work Here it is! I don't know if John has to give you rights, though!

Go to character journal, and click on either of those two. You may need to 'load unsafe scripts' (gray shield in the address bar of chrome) to get the font to load. Edit: Yeah, what he said. Edit, again: the roll templates are set up, but other than initiative, only happen when the correct macro is used. Such macros are set up on "Example Character" as token macros. If they look familiar, its because I outright stole them from the D&D 5th edition roll templates. He did such an awesome job.

Looking cool! How does this .. barebones initiative thing work, for now? Do you have to be a GM to force the roll? And I'm sure this will be a very newbish question, but I'll assume the players can set as many of those 'token button' macros as they want, and name them at their leisure, right? If so: effing A, as they would say in a censored teen movie. Edit: answered my own question; yes - players can change them, and the how to do it is just hidden one tab further to the right. Derp. Still can't see initiative though, but it might be because I'm obtuse!

Its the Action Die button. It rolls a number of dice equal to how many of those checkboxes are checked. Edit: If the roll templates are good, I'll install them in the buttons for skill use, sorcery, and what-not.

Look good to me! Personally though, me and the group are playing a text based game; I like inline rolls because they don't "clog" the log. I noticed that when rolling now, you get a rather nice looking 'parchment' in the log with your rolls in it. It looks good, and if we were playing a voice game - I'd be all over it. Can it be made optional though? (Or is there a more general way to have dice rolls appears in a separate chat 'window'?)

Yes. I can leave them like they are, and let the player build macros if they want. I will include the various names of things in the sheet instructions, though that will take a bit. I got an idea for the initiative; I'm going to try it out now.

Idea didn't work. So...anyway, I chenged initiative into an inline roll (takes up two to three lines of space instead of 8+). That should suit your needs in-so-far as space in concerned. The players will still have to manually enter in the number that were rolled, but its there. Other than that, if yawl are happy with it, I'm happy. I'll bundle it up and push it to github, see about getting it pushed to the server.

Tinkering with it a bit now :)

Looking neat this way - the inline bit makes it great for text games. I take it the initiative isn't automated? (That's fine) So rolling the action dice just has them show up in chat - but it's not linked to the initiative tracker in any way? Same with the rotating images in the combat tab? They've got nothing linked to them? That's fine, I can do that manually - but the rotating images will probably go unused in this case (after all, they'd have to be clicked in place by every individual participant in the combat, just as a memento? Right?) Not criticism, just making sure I got it right! :) If I did, upload away - and we'll have a quick skype later?

Pull request submitted for 7th Sea. Drop a line when you want; I'll turn my skype on. If I'm not online/around, I'll call ya back.

The sheet is now live and availible on roll20 in the campiagn settings dropdown menu.

Cool; I've sent you a few tells on Skype meanwhile. Of the good kind. The sheet survived the first session last Sunday - but one thing's broken; Wounds & Flesh Wounds (the roll & keep soak check) result in error messages (We had that working when we were in the sheet together though - did something change?) And a very good point I can't believe I didn't catch: The ability to add a flat bonus to skill rolls. Right now, the players can only add extra dice; It'd be really cool if there was a numerical field where they could add a flat +5 or +2, as certain advantages grant a flat bonus. One of my players also has a similar advantage for Defence, so if there'd be a way to add a single static field to passive defence, then I think I'm off your back :).

I have no idea what's wrong. I will look at it tomorrow.

Thanks John. 2 weeks till the next session, and in the current state - it already automates a lot / makes playing a lot faster & easier. If you ever want a game of 7th Sea, let me know ;-)

Okay, the wound check breaks when we get to the "keep" part. It will work if its simply Brawn, but breaks if its "Brawn" plus "Wound Check Keep Modifier". Sooooo....I am making the modifier field into the actual field it rolls, with the default numbers number equal to brawn. I'll install a tool tip to make sure its easy to figure out. Also, half the pretty radio buttons I put in aren't working for me. I gotta dig in a see what's up with that.

Added the listed, fixed the wound check, etc. Pull request here

...and the request has already been approved. How about that? Steve K. is awesome. Now we wait until the updates take to the site.

Considering I asked you for this 20hours ago, I'd say you deserve some credit ;-). If you have the hmtl / css in dropbox I'll play around with them a bit before they go live - or I can be a patient boy, and just wait!