Dice Rolling Suggestions

I personally don't want to have to have a programming degree to be able to use the dice roller to it's full functionality. Granted I would probably just keep doing what im doing now (the basic /roll #d# for everything and do the other stuff myself) but still. To a new player it could seem that learning all of the dice commands and syntax is mandatory and that could be a turn off. I would be all for virtual dice that you can roll like Tablet Forge as it adds a bit of nostalgia and roots the game back to its core essence (all of us sitting in a basement somewhere drinking way to much mountain dew and rolling dice all night). Perhaps these Virtual Dice could be rolled in a box in the corner of the screen that could be made bigger or smaller as needed. This would avoid clutter. The rolled dice add a nice visual effect that is easy for new players to see and grasp quickly and you can do all of the math stuff you are talking about yourself.

Tabletop forge has already mentioned adding a "dicebox" or other such thing for those whom wish to keep the dice confined to a specific space. Also, for those whom have tried Fantasy grounds now that rolled dice "disappear" after a few seconds, so there is NO clutter.

I really see no downside to virtual dice. In my experience it is the single biggest barrier to get people to try a VTT. Typing to rolling, using macros or whatever is NO substitute. It slow and dull compared to "rolling dice".

The market offers a LOT of alternatives. Yet with the exception of two (Fantasy Grounds and now Tabletop Forge) all other really don't have much to differentiate them.

The reason Fantasy Grounds (and currently Tabletop Forge) get a lot of buzz is in no small measure due to the virtual dice. Neither of these programs currently has the features some VTT's like Maptools have, heck not even the features roll20 has NOW. So why FG's popularity? Keep in mind you pay for FG, yet they post their subscriber count yearly and I see no competitor touting they have more. Why is that? I'm guessing its the dice.

I've made my case as best I can, the developers of roll20 will do what they think best. Fantasy Grounds set the bar, tabletop forge is following suit. I have no doubt VTT's that don't follow their lead will fall behind in the long run.

Gamers like rolling dice, there is NO substitute.

Peter

I recommended something GUI based early on (maybe in this thread?) but it wasn't pursued. It was just a dice dialog that let you build a dice roll with GUI support. It didn't graphically roll them or anything, but it walked through the process to keep it simple and non-intimidating.

While I want as many game systems supported, natively, as possible, there are really only a few dominant dice rolling methods and the rest are usually variants on that. Roll20 is already approaching the limit of what I'd like to see in dice codes and special characters specifically - I wrote the RandomLeeTwenty dice rolling bot back when Google Wave was a thing, and it ended up with some arcane dice codes because of the way I wrote it (stuff like 6d10esu7+4d10k3h). Add in a few exclamation points and pound signs and it got real ugly.

On the other hand, if the commands issued to it were in a language (call it...DiceBasic or something silly like that), or usable via a GUI (or both!) I think it wouldn't seem so intimidating. GUI-supported dice rolling was something MapTool never got to, and it frequently had the "you need a programming degree to use it" accusation leveled at it.

The only downside I see for virtual dice (besides them bouncing on my graphics), is the interaction and graphical programming needed to get some glitz, when there appear to be more serious issues with Roll20 (actually, I think Tabletop Forge needs to work on other stuff before dice myself, because its interface was tragic the last time I experimented with it). I've used Fantasy Grounds in the past as well, but its interface overall was not to my liking, and the virtual dice were (in my opinion) a novelty.

However, I am perhaps atypical: dice hold no allure for me as artifacts, so I don't have a pressing desire for VTTs to reproduce their physicality. I've used VTTs for gaming almost exclusively for the past 4 years, and I'm more or less at the point where I want the VTT to deliver the answer, but I don't need to see the work.

On the other hand, if virtual dice are the secret to success then, well, I guess they're the secret to success.

Hi!

For those whom have not seen this. Tabletop Forge is already working on virtual roll-able dice that will include the basic

[SNIP ...... /SNIP]

Let's put the "roll" in roll20.

Peter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHebR-149m8

I was just going to post this video :)

However, I am perhaps atypical: dice hold no allure for me as artifacts, so I don't have a pressing desire for VTTs to reproduce their physicality.

I wouldn't say that you're atypical, but at the same time, I do think many people ignore that a large chuck of the user base would benefit from on-table dice. In my case, it's because many of the games that I ~want~ to play treat dice as physical objects, meant to be moved about, shared, and placed. In short, the dice are often more than just a random number generator.

Now, I don't need (or even want) the 'dice rolling around in a physically simulated manner' effect. There may be instances where games require dice to actually bounce about, but I'm unaware of any examples. (If anyone knows of any example, please do share, I'd love to hear about them :)). But I ~do~ really want to be able to create a small pool of dice on the table, select them (perhaps like tokens), and press a button (or hotkey) to randomize their faces and orientations. That's my two cents.

Now that would be fine (actually, upon reflection, I think what MapTool, and for the moment Roll20, are really "critically missing" is some obvious "Here is where you roll dice" location, rather than hiding dice power in the chat interface). Dice you can throw, buttons shaped like the dice, buttons simply labeled "D4", "D6", "D8", etc., a little window/box like you suggested, are a big deal. I do agree.

In fact, some of the first things I did with MapTool, and with Roll20 when the macro button bar appeared, were to create buttons labeled with "d4" and "d6" and so on.

It be nice to give players access to coding their own dice. Since players already have the ability to use certain predefined functions, like adding, exploding, targets, etc., it would appear to be possible for players to create their own functions.

see http://anydice.com/ for what I'd imagine. I've had 3 years in programming with c and c++ and this was extremely easy to pick up.

Penetration dice are used in all Kenzerco games(Hackmaster 4th, Hackmaster New Edition, Aces and Eights, other board games and smaller games they have). They are exactly like exploding dice except you subtract one per exploding die. They also will have the ability to penetrate(explode) on lower numbers like you are currently adding.

In regards to keeping the low rolls, I'd suggest a minor change to the existing script. Where in expression /roll NdXkY you'd keep Y highest dice, perhaps in /roll NdXdY you'd drop Y highest dice.

There's really no need for the k/d system to exist as-is, it's basic math.

You'd have to use a different letter than 'd' since it is already syntactically taken.

Nah, just change what "d" does. This is in beta; if they say " 'NdXdY' now drops the Y highest dice, instead of its old behavior," that's not out of line, I think. At the moment, the behavior of the keep and drop options are redundant, so if they say "fixed redundancy of keep and drop dice codes," all is good.

I know that only one system uses them, but the dice for Warhammer Fantasy Third Ed. would be pretty cool to see. They use pictures, not number, so im not sure how they would be implemented using the current system, but ive seen apps for them on iphone and android.

The reason Fantasy Grounds (and currently Tabletop Forge) get a lot of buzz is in no small measure due to the virtual dice.

FWIW iTabletop v3, another web-based virtual tabletop (very similar in concept to Tabletop Forge and Roll20) is also adding 3d virtual dice with collision detection.

Sweet! Glad to see VTT makers are finally realizing 3d dice are the way to go. The more the merrier.

Edit: Just checked iTabletop out Axel. Pretty darn cool. Their ability to actually define die faces (characteristics) is VERY useful and as far as I can tell unique amongst VTT so (tabletop forge has not done this yet but will). Thanks for the tip! ;)

Peter

Re roll values:
1d20+5r(1) Re roll 1's
1d20+5r(1,2,5) Re roll 1's, 2's and 5's

Custom Dice:
#d{*sides*} ---------- number of dice "d" {list of types}
Ex:
1d{left_arm, right_arm, left_leg, right_leg, chest, head} (random body part)
5d{head, tails} (5 coin flips)

Reroll was exactly what I was thinking of. To keep in line with other roll commands shouldn't it be 1d20r1 though?

Reasoning for why I think this makes sense. Currently playing D&D 4.0 with a warlock. I have curse damage that sometimes is rolled with an attacks damage (to make it easier/faster). I only want to reroll ones on my curse damage but not on the actual spell damage for whatever I am casting. This would allow multiple rolls and multiple variances.

/roll 1d6r1 (Single Dice)
/roll 1d10 + 6 + 1d6r1 (Damage + Dice with reroll value)
/roll 1d10r2 + 6 + 1d6r1 (Two reroll dice with different reroll values)

I think you get the idea.

As for rerolling multiple values I am curious to where that would be needed. I just don't know of any game where you would be rerolling a 3 but not a 1 or 2.

To implement rerolling multiple values I think adding multiple r# makes more sense than using '(',')' and ','.

/roll 1d6r1r3
/roll 1d20r1r5r13

This may be the more optimal solution as I think the most common reroll case is reroll ones and these edge cases or rerolling twos would be a lot simpler with this roll command.

Thanks for reading!

Parametrized Macros.

I want to have a damage Macro as such.

Macro: Kill
/roll 1d10 + 6 + {0}

When calling macro I want to do something like #Kill 1d6.

This would then roll 1d10 + 6 + 1d6.

Many times during games you received bonuses that modify your rolls in some way. Being able to provide that additional damage would help not having to type out rolls every few rounds that a macro could quickly help. While the one above is not terribly complex it can also add some additional problems with loss of information.

Example of Loss of Information:

Macro: DwF
/roll 1d10 + 6 Darkworm Feast (Necrotic Damage)
Dark Pact: Enemy takes 3 damage at start of it's next turn.

Now when I actually type this out due to have a +2 damage bonus I have lost all the information about necrotic damage and dark pact bonus effect. While in most cases this is not a huge issue I find having the information spelled out for me, the dm, and the rest of the gaming group makes a HUGE difference. Information can get lost when verbally communicating. A lot goes on in some games between 1 enemy/character's turn and losing a slow, 3 extra damage, or whatever can be huge.

Thanks for reading!

I would really like to see better Savage Worlds support -- in Savage Worlds you take the better of two exploding dice (a main die and a 'Wild' die). Both Fantasy Grounds and TabletopForge support this. Right now, as a workaround, you can roll two exploding dice, but you have to ignore the result -- not the best experience. Thanks.

I would really like to see better Savage Worlds support -- in Savage Worlds you take the better of two exploding dice (a main die and a 'Wild' die). Both Fantasy Grounds and TabletopForge support this. Right now, as a workaround, you can roll two exploding dice, but you have to ignore the result -- not the best experience. Thanks.

Having just switched an existing campaign over to Savage Worlds, I've been wrestling with this a little myself. What I ultimately decided to do was to create macros for each die and within those macros had the trait and wild die each on its own line. This provides the output of each roll without adding them together and producing an extraneous number. As a plus, each roll can also be labeled so that there's never any question as to which was the trait roll and which was the wild die.

That said, I feel like it could be implemented a little bit more smoothly. My instinct at the moment is to take the Savage Worlds game to Fantasy Grounds as I do have that license. My players seem a little resistant to pick up and move, though, and I do like Roll20 an awful lot so I'm going to try sticking it out.

It'd be amazing to see a more elegant solution for Savage Worlds' unique die mechanic, though.

I know this is my pet dice rolling issue, but are there any plans on the docket to alter the drop/keep so that it will allow the dropping of high rolls too? Either by changing it so that Drop and Keep only refer to the highest N dice (i.e., /roll 3d6k2 keeps the highest two, and /roll 3d6d2 drops the highest two), or adding another roll command? It would be handy for D&D Next, Barbarians of Lemuria, Dungeon World, and other games.

I'm going to be stepping up to help Riley with dice rolling mechanics. I'm planning on reading through this thread and summarizing the concrete feature requests and making a new dice-rolling-suggestions post. The more concrete the examples the better as I don't have a lot of familiarity with the various dice systems that are out there. I'm not sure when exactly this is going to happen but likely within the next week I'll start the summary work.

I think that there should be an assumed one so if you wrote /roll d20 it would be the same as /roll 1d20, because I find having to input the 1 just an unnecessary annoyance.

@Fletcher ... that is one of the first things I'll be doing

http://xkcd.com/208/

Snrk.

A man once had a problem. "I know," he says, "I can solve it with regular expressions!"

The man then had two problems.

D&D 4e has some weapons with the "Brutal" keyword. Example: Craghammer is Brutal 2. Which means if you roll a 1 or 2 on the damage roll you get to re-roll the damage dice. Is there any way you guys could implement a dice rolling macro that lets you set a minimum number that the dice itself is allowed to roll.

So for instance my craghammer is 1d10+4 damage.

With that I'm supposed to reroll the d10 if I roll a 1 or a 2. Rerolling clogs up chat though. Can we do something like /roll 1d10(>3)+4

That way the roll will recognize to only go as low as 3 Or if you want the text to look different maybe /roll 1d10min3+4 so as to not confuse with success rolls.

Just a suggestion. I've seen a few people use brutal keyword weapons and I think it would help a lot.

A simpler approach might be 1d10r3+4 (the r3 meaning "reroll if less than 3")

Some kind of roll request the DM can make would be nice. Say he needs a character or group of characters to do initiative. What I'd want to be able to do is send out a request to all the players, and they can respond with whatever they need to. This would allow all the responses to be grouped together, regardless of who talked in between each response.

I feel using a graphically interactive die AND a text based box that tell you the result of the die roll. I cant remember which program it was that I saw that does this but this link http://youtu.be/n94E3IeBquY?t=1m26s for the Microsoft tablet gets across my point. Being able to select how many of what die i.e. 3d12 and have one roll in which you grab the one die, and when you flick it, 3 different d12 die would come from it and bounce off the end zone of the window which would be nice if you can adjust the size and have it pop-out as well as having a text box window which displays the result of the 3d12 rolled. This gives you that get together and physically roll die feel but would also do the math to show you how it got its result. A lot to ask, but just thought I'd throw out my 3¢ on what I would like to see done with, as an option, or separate from the current die system. Great job so far all the same.

I am not sure if anyone has brought this up yet... but I bought the beta book at Gen Con for the New Fantasy Flight Star Wars RPG... and it has completely custom dice.

3 Positive dice (Green, Yellow, Blue): d12, d8, d6
3 Negative dice (Purple, Red, Black): same
1 Force dice (White): d12

These all have symbols on the sides... sometimes 2 on a side (for 2 hits, etc). These dice sound complicated, but actually once you know how to read them, they are pretty cool.

With the way Roll20 is now, the only way to interpret these is roll with the normal dice... then use some sheet to cross reference the symbols which is very time consuming.

Any possibility of this being supported? I assume the game will probably be popular since it is Star Wars.

Glad you brought this up BrashFink. The new Star Wars RPG uses the same die mechanic as Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 3rd edition (just with different colors and symbols on the dice). It'd be great if Roll20 could support them both.

I think it is a bit different... i am not exactly certain because I never played WH40K, but on the SWRPG forums, it seems are mentioning slight differences.

I will write up info on the dice and faces later tonight when I get home.

The approach in WFRP3 (not WH40K; those are all percentile systems) and the new SW game are the same (build a dice pool from the various kinds of dice, roll, and interpret the results based on the symbols showing). What would be required is the ability to create custom dice with custom faces. I have done this in MapTool using its table feature, but Roll20 doesn't have the capability yet. It would be a nice addition.

Oh okay. I just knew they said the symbols were not the same. You mean same kind of mechanic.

Also, about the name... sorry, I have no idea even what game they are actually referring to, i thought it was some kind of Warhammer game. I just know it is another product from FFG.

Sorry, I shouldn't have used the acronym. Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 3rd Edition is set in the Warhammer Fantasy universe, and is the one with the various custom dice using different symbols (in the same vein as the new Star Wars beta). It originally came in a ~$100 box set with the dice, cards, and all kinds of widgets and such.

FFG also puts out games set in the Warhammer 40K universe, but they use a percentile system instead.

I'm not sure if someone has noticed this but on Game Table, they have a feature that allows you to save your dice macros as a file you can reload later. As a GM, this is an awesome feature. I can make a set of kobold, goblin and ogre macros, load one set, use them, then load another set for the next encounter. This allows me to reuse old macros in later encounters or games and not have a list of 200 macros to fish through looking for "the ones I made for kobolds" each time. Game Table has a window that allows you to just click a button that says "roll" beside each macro, saving even more time by removing the typing aspect all together. There's also an edit button, to change an existing macro, both name and formula ("longsword att" = d20+5 to "+1 longsword att" = 20+6). Game Table is no longer supported, so I'm not sure how the legal stuff would work but having a way to filter and save macros would be awesome.

So I saw some discussion on sorting dice rolls in ascending order, I understand that having them show up in the order they were rolled would help for special dice, but having the option to choose between natural roll order and ascending would make a world of difference for those of us who would like to use roll20 with ORE (One Roll Engine) based games.

Perhaps just putting a check box into settings that would allow GM's to switch between these two would streamline ORE games where players are looking for matched sets of dice as opposed to totals or individual dice value.

Ill give you an example:

In this REIGN campaign our player Mike has his character separated from the group while fleeing from the city guard after stealing a valuable scroll from the city library. After a couple loops around the city square (yakity sax song optional) he rounds back to the main gates that are drawing close even as he approaches. In his way, a dozen guards stand between him and freedom. Mike tumbles through the mass, attempting to dodge their grasping hands.

At this point, Mike rolls his dodge pool, while the unworthy guard collective rolls its attempts to grab a hold of him. Both parties are rolling a fairly large pool of dice and looking for matches, as follows with the current roll20 dice roller.

Mike: /roll 8d10 =
(9+3+8+6+4+8+6+3)
=
47

Guards: /roll 12d10 =
(9+8+9+1+1+8+5+8+7+2+2+8)
=
68

The totals are meaningless to us and the players must sort out the number and value of their matches. As the dice pools are frequently of this size, you can see it becomes a little tedious to figure out just exactly who succeeded (and by what amount) without examining the rolls for a moment. If however we were to arrange our rolls in an ascending order as so...


Mike: /roll 8d10 =
(3+3+4+6+6+8+8+9)
=
47

Guards: /roll 12d10 =
(1+1+2+2+5+7+8+8+8+8+9+9)
=
68

We can much more easily see that mike has acquired a pair of 3s,6s, and 8s, while the guard has acquired a pair of 1s, 2s, 9s, and four matching 8s.

For your consideration I feel like this would be fairly simple to implement (although an actual ORE dice roller, possibly with colored matches or something at some point would be incredible), and would allow players and GMs the option of utilizing the roll20s incredibly user friendly and intuitive dice less interface as an effective form of ORE gaming.

Would probably be easier to make a graphical user interface which exactly, digitally does what physical die rolls do. So, you pick your dice at the beginning, they remain on you virtual tabletop, you highlight to select which to roll, and hit "Enter."

Summarized and moved to: http://community.roll20.net/discussion/2236/dice-rolling-plans-suggestions