The new prices for additional storage are *absurd*

I'm glad to see that Roll20 is no longer in the beta stage and I'm also glad to see that we can now purchase more space, but the current fees are beyond absurd. You guys are asking us to pay a fee monthly/yearly that is on average 75 times greater than almost any other hosting provider out there. Look, I understand that getting the additional storage is not free, but it is nowhere near the prices you guys are asking. The average price per gigabyte for web storage is about $0.07 dollars. That's right, it is literally seven cents a gig. And that is with a monthly fee. I understand that there are other features that come with paying for these fees, but honestly they do not in any way justify the prices.

We're a free service. You can get 100 MBs of storage for free. Further, the perks extend well beyond storage space. And there will be more perks as they come out of development. Our pricing is comparable with plenty of other RPG services, and I know that our free service is far beyond what many other paid RPG models have to offer. The fact is, if Roll20 is going to continue at the pace we set during beta, we're going to need more hours in the day, which comes down to needing more resources. The more resources we have, the more features and generosity we intend to return to this community. You are welcome to delete files to gain more space. If that still isn't enough space, we hope that you can understand the need to place incentives somewhere to begin the process of moving this service forward to a sustainable model.

What services? iTabletop offers 10gigs for a one time payment of $14.95 SceneGrinder offered what they said was unlimited space for $27.00 a year or $3.00 a month (their site is gone, no link anymore :( ) These are the only other web based VTT (that I can find) that also offered addition services.

Firstly, I was speaking about overall service. Secondly, bringing up those two virtual tabletops merely reinforces the point-- neither of those services have a sustainable model. There aren't enough users for either service (particularly the one that is closed), to keep the services running. Roll20 wants to be around for a long time. Our user base is large and rapidly growing. If we can convert a constant, say, 3% of our user base to paid models, we'll be able to keep up with future costs AND add increasing value to subscriptions. If you are not interested in that, then continue to use the service for free. 100MBs is more than enough space for campaigns (none of the development team has ever surpassed that personal limit). That said, this is not a debate. We would love for every portion of this service to cost nothing, but we're talking about a service whose users have already logged over FORTY-FIVE YEARS of in game play. There are costs associated with simply keeping that afloat, let alone hoping to someday be compensated personally for the amount of time we put into the program. We hope our users understand and will support us to better enrich the service for the future.

iTabletop has been around for a couple of years. But roll20 is more than like going to destroy them. But enough of that. You're right, this is not a debate. I am merely voicing my... lack of love for these prices. I personally find them outrageous and know all of my players I have talked about this with feel the same. Question, if we were to buy space, fill up beyound the normal 100 megs, and then go back to the free subscription, what happens to the items that went over the limit?

Worth noting; iTabletop doesn't allow free users to join games that don't have available floating licenses, create games, or use text to speak 'in character.' On top of limiting the number of free players a campaign can have, and how many campaigns you can run... well -at least- two of those would be pretty big issues for me. Roll20's free offers are pretty dang nice TBH, Unlimited campaigns, no limit on the number of players per campaign, 100 mb of storage for nothing, this plus all the features everyone else gets. I think the hanging point though is that atm capacity is really the major difference between the levels, capacity is and has never really been an issue for me (and not just because I'm already a mentor) Since May Ive racked up a hefty capacity of only seven megabytes and I dont see me pushing it much beyond the basic 100 megs, this is without using any paid marketplace material (though I'll be fixing that soon) and only custom tokens as well as some custom map tiles.

Lol, a character sheet I made is well over 100MB (its fancy) , Wouldnt mind paying a 1 time fee or something like that per extra 100 MB that I want, I just cant spend that kinda scratch every month, or every year. I would rather have to pay a little more for a lifetime thing, than the every year/month thing.

Question, if we were to buy space, fill up beyound the normal 100 megs, and then go back to the free subscription, what happens to the items that went over the limit? Nothing-- you'd simply not be able to upload more until you were back on a subscription plan.

Wouldnt mind paying a 1 time fee or something like that per extra 100 MB that I want, I just cant spend that kinda scratch every month, or every year. I would rather have to pay a little more for a lifetime thing, than the every year/month thing. That is what I was hoping for. We can't even upload our own music to use, so there is not much we can do with that much space. Nothing-- you'd simply not be able to upload more until you were back on a subscription plan. Okay, good! I was hoping it would be that. But you would still be able to access anything that went over that limit?

Lol, a character sheet I made is well over 100MB (its fancy) , Wouldnt mind paying a 1 time fee or something like that per extra 100 MB that I want, I just cant spend that kinda scratch every month, or every year. I would rather have to pay a little more for a lifetime thing, than the every year/month thing. What sort of image format are you using? Even using a 220DPI screen (what a retina macbook pro has) 100MB fills up a 26"x26" square for an uncompressed .bmp. If you are using png or something else that has compression it would be even bigger!

I saved a file that is 16 X 22 and it is in PDF format

Not to come off as snide, but isn't complaining about the the prices of additional (key word here, additional. no requirement, no obligation) features in a free service kind of trite? I mean.. when the kickstarter was up and running, would we have stood around and said things like "25$ as a contributor? why the heck would I pay for something like this when I (from my standpoint) get nothing.. and I could get a DDI subscription (or insert whatever) instead?" the fact of the matter is, people who want to make use of the alpha releases, and some extra space, will pay the premium to be contributors, no questions asked, and likely - no complaints at it. Why? because they're probably similarly minded to the people that shelled out cash months before the service took off, just at the thought of what a service like this could really provide. Me? I'm not GM'ing yet, so I'll probably stick free. but in a couple months? 5$ a month if I'm running a few games? *so I drink one less cup of fair-trade coffee this month, poor me* bottom line - This is a great service, and like any free service, it comes with limitations. and like any other free service, there are options that come at premiums. Only you can decide if shelling out the cash for those, but claiming their *actual* values against the userbase? not so much. Keep up the good work Roll20

I didn't hesitate at all in signing up for $10 a month. Why? because the value is there. Easily. It isn't just about "storage". When the OP posted what he believes the real cost of storage is, he didn't stop to think about what it takes to provide that storage, and what it costs to develop and maintain this online tool. The additional benefits are more than worth it and this team has proven that it is in it for the long haul. They have kept their promises and continued to develop the tool. That in itself is worthy of my money, especially given that other tools out there plainly SUCK. Kudos to the Roll 20 team. I couldn't be happier.

Not to come off as snide, but isn't complaining about the the prices of additional (key word here, additional. no requirement, no obligation) features in a free service kind of trite? Sure, if the price was reasonable, the complaint was absurd, and this wasn't a business. I mean.. when the kickstarter was up and running, would we have stood around and said things like "25$ as a contributor? why the heck would I pay for something like this when I (from my standpoint) get nothing.. and I could get a DDI subscription (or insert whatever) instead?" This argument does not make sense. I'm not even sure what your point is. Can you explain? the fact of the matter is, people who want to make use of the alpha releases, and some extra space, will pay the premium to be contributors, no questions asked, and likely - no complaints at it. Why? because they're probably similarly minded to the people that shelled out cash months before the service took off, just at the thought of what a service like this could really provide. And I'm not complaining about that. Actually, the $9.99 tier is almost worth it due to the development server access alone (if they can keep the alpha features interesting and useful). It's the $4.99 tier that I am complaining about. That may not have been clear. Me? I'm not GM'ing yet, so I'll probably stick free. but in a couple months? 5$ a month if I'm running a few games? *so I drink one less cup of fair-trade coffee this month, poor me* And for your $5 a month you're only getting a gig. In other places that gig would cost you as little as 5 cents. On Google the same $5 would get you 100GB and an extra 25GB in your Gmail account. See, it's not about the cost by itself. It's the cost relative to what we're getting. The last time a single GB cost $5 was about ten years ago . I would be perfectly fine with paying $5 if I was getting something close to being worth $5. Even marginally close would be fine. bottom line - This is a great service, Yes it is. I never said it wasn't. and like any free service, it comes with limitations. And I am not complaining about those limits. Those are reasonable and understandable. and like any other free service, there are options that come at premiums. Of course, but it is the comparison to other places that host content that make the absurdity of trying to offer 1GB for $5 evident. Only you can decide if shelling out the cash for those, but claiming their *actual* values against the userbase? not so much. Keep up the good work Roll20

iTabletop doesn't allow (...) use text to speak 'in character.' FWIW the last iTabletop update (to v3) added a way for speaking in character, also displaying in the chat box the thumbnails of the character token or portrait, regardless it is a PC, NPC or "whatever". However, the thing has many loose ends ATM. Now, I'd like to see character thumbnails displayed in the Roll20 chat box too, and I know that this already has been requested as a suggestion. In this context of subscription fees, something like that amounts to a continued, reliable development for Roll20 , which I think is one of Nolan T. J's points. There are already too many unfinished virtual tabletops around, clumsily walking with extremely large tails of sensible feature requests that never see the light of the day: for one, I don't want to see Roll20 turned into another of them because a lack of resources, a lack motivated users or a lack of incentives for the developers.

In the Subscription page under the Frequently Asked Questions, it states; "Each subscription includes great perks which give you more direct access to the Dev Team, as well as some tools useful for "power users" who manage lots of campaigns". What are these perks and useful tools that go along with the extra storage space?

In the Subscription page under the Frequently Asked Questions, it states; "Each subscription includes great perks which give you more direct access to the Dev Team, as well as some tools useful for "power users" who manage lots of campaigns". What are these perks and useful tools that go along with the extra storage space? @ $4.99/mo it looks like you get "Unlimited Active Listings" w/ Looking for Players (on top of 1GB storage) @ $9.99/mo you get that, as well as "Email Support Directly from the Dev Team", full dev server access for you and your players (which includes access to alpha features), highlighted LFP listings, and an extra 1GB I think perhaps it might behoove Roll20 to offer an "a la carte" storage option... maybe $3.49/mo for a boost to 1GB (waived for supporter/mentor subscribers) with the option to add more storage for $1/GB/month... so if you didn't want the LFP listings you could get 2GB of storage for a little less than the supporter tier, or a supporter could get 2GB for only $1/mo extra instead of $5/mo (but sacrificing dev server access, email support, and highlighted listings). Additionally, it'd allow mentor subscribers to further upgrade their storage. Theyian, you need to remember that their "storage" fees also include bandwidth; transmitting these tokens, tiles, game sheets, and the like to all players. This is considerably more expensive, and also a "repetitive" expense, ultimately exceeding a one time fee.

I understand that Jessie and the prices I have listed were from companies that offered bandwidth for extremely cheap (Google, Amazon, Dropbox, you name it) along with the price of the space.

'save for web devices' is my best friend in photoshop. I'm still only at 15 MB so far. not to mention the whole sharing of assets thing ; " Q. Does this count toward my quota? No, assets that you upload to share with the community don't count toward your quota. In addition, when Roll20 users utilize a Marketplace asset (free or premium) in their campaigns, it does not count against their quota, either. "

Honestly I wish there was a lower tier of subscription. I dont need the additional storage or anything like that for what we do, but I would love to just throw a $20 towards roll20 to support the project etc. Maybe a forum badge or something as a show of our support only, who knows.

Hey roll20 wanna make some Money? Sell different Skins for your Dice. eg Steel or Marble etc. A one time fee but I think this community would eat it up. I can't think of a more profitable way to make cash then selling virtual goods.

If I am understanding this correctly, if I upload my tile sets to the Market Place then I don't get that storage applied to my personal quota of 100 MB. Now I have designed these specifically for Roll20. I want nothing for them, if Roll20 would want to charge for them I don't care. With these Tiles just about any fantasy setting could be created, but they aren't very useful for a modern setting. Now here is my real point, if I upload them, can I delete them out of my Personal Library without it affecting my existing modules (campaigns)? I will post this as a separate item also.

If I am understanding this correctly, if I upload my tile sets to the Market Place then I don't get that storage applied to my personal quota of 100 MB. Now I have designed these specifically for Roll20. I want nothing for them, if Roll20 would want to charge for them I don't care. With these Tiles just about any fantasy setting could be created, but they aren't very useful for a modern setting. Correct, if you upload them to the marketplace and let people use them for free they won't count toward your quote. If you want to sell them you and Roll20 make money off of that arrangement. Now here is my real point, if I upload them, can I delete them out of my Personal Library without it affecting my existing modules (campaigns)? I believe you'd have to re-add the images to your existing campaigns.

Saereth may be onto something for those of us who would like to contribute a little something, but not pay a monthly fee. A bit of merchandise might be nice, though I have no idea what the cost model would be before you would be making a profit. I'm not so keen on the skins idea, only because those who cant afford it miss out on an aspect of the interface, rather than just a consumable. Also it start to smell like a free to play model.

For a subscription, what are some of the current and proposed 'tools useful for "power users"'?

Ok, so to recap how my own current workplan is looking. 1 - Add a tileset to the community wherein sewers/bunkers can be assembled. (got the basics done from working with Dundjinni, would just need to convert) 2 - Upload larger map files onto personal account, I have 300mbs of those after ten years of GMing, I don't think I will need to have more than maybe 10mb uploaded at any one time. 3 - Upload everything else on GDrive, and share with those who should have it. (among other things, character sheets) I am not paying anything and getting a pretty good service. I am satisfied.

The title had me zeroing in on this thread. I have to say, I did not equate the storage to the price. At this point, the overall cloud service and dynamic lighting in particular made the service well worth the cost of at least a "Supporter" subscription. I wish I'd known about it during the kickstarter campaign! I consider myself pretty frugal, but this is a hobby I'm willing to spend money on, and within a week of tooling around on Roll20, I was intrigued enough to pay to be a supporter. And I continue to be impressed, and am looking forward to others with a similar mindset contributing to this great product so that more enhancements can be made! Count me among your raving fans!