G-Carrier

The "G" is for "GANGSTA!" Actually, it's probably for "grav". But maybe for us it could mean "Great value for anyone looking for high end security transport"? Started this topic so that we weren't de-railing the thread about the Ares/Apollo.  So this is where we calk about how we're going to "Trump up" the G-limo. Mirror balls, neons, alternating grav units that make it hop up and down ... all essential gear. 

There are two versions of the G-Carrier in the Military Vehicles supplement; a TL 10 and a TL 15.  I think for both of them we could remove the weaponry. That'd both save us a ton of money ( 15Mcr for the TL 15's Fusion Gun ) and give us something that's a bit more street legal.  The main difference between both of them is the armour. The TL 10 has Crystaliron armour, while the TL 15 has Bonded Superdense.  There seems to be a difference between the Military Vehicle supplement's construction system and the Civilian one. I can't see what kind of "sealing" any of these military vehicles have. Maybe it's assumed that they're all kitted out for "extreme environments"? That would make sense seeing that they're probably designed to be hauled from world to world and built to hold together under battlefield conditions.   Either that or maybe we need to design one from scratch using the Civ supplement rather than the Military one? Being able to stay together in an "insidious" environment is important not only for the Maarg job but also to provide the maximum level of protection for our potential clients. If they need to get somewhere on a world with an corrosive or insidious atmosphere then we need to be equipped and ready to take them there.

For goodness’s sake, leave that trashy property flipper out of this...

And if our customer need to be picked up/dropped off in an corrosive atmosphere, they can pay for the remodeling of the g-carrier. after all, its  top end customers that pay, and they are the ones we want.

One thing has nothing to do with the other. Wypoc is not a “Pick Up and Deliver VIP” mission. Regardless, if we were delivering a customer to a place like Wypoc, they would understand about the dingy mode of transport.

I'm wondering if a G-Carrier can be made tough enough to handle corrosive environments to the point where it doesn't need to be repaired every time it goes out. Maybe a fresh lick of paint but nothing major. Bonded Superdense has got to be good for something right? We're talking about a magical space aged material that is beyond our current understanding of how molecules bond together. Fusion guns have a tough time getting through this stuff. That's got to be hard to pull apart even for an "insidious" environment. We're talking TL 14 here. Millions of people living on insidious atmosphere worlds seems like a hit that our problems have some kind of solution.  And if you think about it, Wypoc could be seen as a “Pick Up and Deliver VIP” mission. Our VIP may not be co-operative, but we actually need to protect him and bring him in alive. Our main challenge is that the threats we need to protect our passenger from are actually within our own company. That and the fact that we've booked him a seat against his will. 

I really love the lines of that one in the middle. Sleek! Anyone know what it's called? EDIT: "Empress APC". Just thought it looked kinda groovy. A little more stylish than the other ones. 

No, worst-case, Wypoc is a “VUP” mission... “Very Un important Person”... Even if we don’t get to kill Maarg outright, that doesn’t mean we have to care about his level of luxury, or even comfort . The “G-Carrier on Wypoc” problem is like so: The exterior gets pitted due to rain, wind, and general atmosphere Even if you can keep the atmosphere out of the luxurious plushness of the cabin with a pressure differential, you’re tracking those problems in without a decontamination unit in the airlock Wasting time on that is a no-go during a combat situation, which Wypoc inevitably will be Which means the acidic gasses and liquids will be tracked in, eating through the luxurious plushness like candy This would force everyone inside to wear battledress to keep the acidic gasses and liquids out, which would inevitably tear up the luxurious plushness due to general clumsiness So... yeah, it just wouldn’t work, and you’d notice the repair job over time as the acids you didn’t get out before the repaint (because they’re insidious) ruin the fresh paint-job. Better to have a G-Carrier that was never subject to those conditions to begin with.

Don't G'Carriers come with an Air Lock? I can't find it in the Mongoose write up but I'm pretty sure they did back in the old days. If G-Carries don't come with one standard that's definitely something we should think about.  I know there is an air lock "Item" in the CSC somewhere. If we have to temporarily rig something up that maybe the way to go?

Even if it came with a regular airlock, decontaminating airlocks are different, take longer , and as such, the whole thing really isn’t viable for the Maarg mission.

We get a  decontaminating airlock then ....  Not sure why "the whole thing really isn’t viable for the Maarg mission." Hard to imagine there not being vehicles on Wypoc already with this kind of set up.  EDIT: Oh wait ... yeah we don't need to pimp out a lux G-carrier till after we've finished with Maag. Is that what you mean when you say it "isn't viable"?

It takes time to decontaminate, proper airlock or not. Mid-combat is not the place for that sort of fussiness. Also, yeah, it’s an “after Maarg” problem, so we can get a new one after. Assuming we don’t have to run the hell away , we can probably sell the G-Carrier we just used on Wypoc itself, since Wypoc tends to chew those up and spit them out...

Tenacious Techhunter said: It takes time to decontaminate, proper airlock or not. Mid-combat is not the place for that sort of fussiness. So lets not do it mid combat. Also, yeah, it’s an “after Maarg” problem, so we can get a new one after. Assuming we don’t have to run the hell away , we can probably sell the G-Carrier we just used on Wypoc itself, since Wypoc tends to chew those up and spit them out... At 15Mcr a piece ... lets hope not! Would put a dent in their ecconomy I'd say. 

Talking about keeping things sealed from hostile environments, thought it'd be good to post this: Hostile Environment Life Support: Allows a vehicle to support its occupants in hostile environments such as high–radiation regions and insidious atmospheres. Other systems will break down quickly under such conditions. Requires a hostile environment adapted (Advanced Sealed) vehicle. ( p20 Military Vehicles ) Not much use without an airlock though. Decontamination Airlocks take up 12m^3. Almost 1dton.  It looks like they designed the G-Carrier in the book based on real life APC - but with the ability to fly. I would think that If I was trying to sell G-Carriers in the Traveller universe I'd be making them so that the Marines/Army/Mercenaries could take them anywhere - including battle fields loaded with radioactive fall out, chemical weapons and so on. Would also be great to be able to take them into hostile environments. You really don't want your controls being melted by hostile atmosphere every time someone opens the door, so it seems silly to build a "fight anywhere" vehicle without an airlock. Even if the standard one doesn't have an airlock, we really need one that does. Without it we're going to have a tough time rescuing folks if we need to.  

Crazy idea - and feel free to shoot it down - what if we designed a carrier based on the small craft rules in High Guard?  Hear me out.  I was thinking it'd be cool to have a G-Carrier style craft that was modular. So Control cabin in the front, airlock at the back, and a modular section in the middle a bit like a modular cutter. For us this would usually be passenger seating, but we could swap it out for a stateroom for long trips, a "gunship" module loaded with weapons, a cargo carrying module, an ECM surveillance module ... whatever we think we'd need. Seeing that the ground vehicle creation rules don't really have the modular option, we'd either need to house rule them in or we could make the carrier a 10dton (or less) small craft. I haven't taken a close look at this idea yet so I'm not even sure if it's viable. But to be able to do ship to ship transfers in a Carrier would be cool.  The down side is that ship scale stuff doesn't work on a personal scale. It looks like they went half way toward solving that issue though. In High Guard small craft have a Hull and Structure in both personal scale and ship scale. So it looks like the intention was for small craft to enter into personal scale battles. The problem is they never list the default armour value for small craft. So in the end you have to house rule it, or go with the current "divide damage by 50 when attacking ships" rule. But if that's the case why provide personal scale Hull and Structure values? In Classic Traveller's Striker supplement, and I think in Megatraveller, a standard starship had an armour value of 40. That could work for us maybe? Anyhoo .. just thought I'd throw this idea in. I'm not emotionally married to the idea or anything. I just thought it may be cool to have a modular G-Carrier. 

Interesting, but aside from all of the questions you raised, it would mean that we'd have to haul all of the extra modules around. That's a big part of why the cutters didn't work for us.

Mongoose Traveller’s Ship rules, Vehicle Rules, and Personal Combat rules, are all incompatible. If there were a stronger base for this idea, it might be worth a thought, but there isn’t, so I think we’ll just have to give up on it.

Fair points. I figured the modules would be about 5dtons each. And if we're not going to use them regularly it may be a waste of space.  No probs. 

BUMP

Why are we bumping this?

Tenacious Techhunter said: Why are we bumping this? Because we need to decide on the specs, pay for it and set up a tab in the docs.

Ah; you’re bumping the general thread, not the last train of thought...

This may sound nutso ... But can we have two G-carriers? and can we get a discount for carriers that don't have FGMPs?

I'd like to see some equipment included in either of these vehicles medical wise or have another configured to evac wounded from the surface.

Gimmielots said: I'd like to see some equipment included in either of these vehicles medical wise or have another configured to evac wounded from the surface. We have lots of med kit and survival gear, if there is any thing specific you think we need, put in a list including book page number and cost in Runts Q-Store tab. a second G carrier would be nice. FGMP or No FGMP

We have lots of grenade launchers that can probably be mounted on the G-Carriers. Alby, refresh our memories; how much room does the Shuttle have for “toys” again?

23.75 ton of cargo. The type of grenade launchers we have are not suitable as mounted grenade launchers. We could go with a missile launcher or plasma gun for the second G carrier

Is the caliber to the grenade launchers different or something? If I were to guess, they’re only missing the mounts... which means we’d only pay the difference from the mounted version... CSC has rules for the vehicle-mounted version of weapons which would apply to this, so long as the ammo and the performance are the same.

Our GL's are under slung attachments for rifles, GL's for weapons mounts are bigger , Auto and have large mag capacity.

Yeah what Vic said. one of the security folks has medic skill as well as Hvy Wpns (FA). So a medivac g-carrier with MRL or some other kind of long range artillery would be great.  I'd like to see some equipment included in either of these vehicles medical wise or have another configured to evac wounded from the surface yeah me too. The TL 14 medpod we got that can put dead people back together is only any good if we can get the dead meat into it within 15 mins. So we need that gear close by. Would be To have that in a carrier.

Provided they have circulation Fast Drug will ensure that we can get them into that Pod and back to the ship where we'll have the equipment to get them back on their feet.

I still don't get the point of another G-Carrier. The Assault Shuttle, as spec-ed out at the moment as 1.25 dtons of available space, so it's certainly not going in there. We do still have the room in the Athena's hangar, though, so we could put one in there. But we already have an Assault Shuttle, a G-Carrier, an Air/Raft and two Grav Bikes.  I'm not sure we could effectively crew all of our ships and vehicles even with all hands on deck. As for the FGMP, I don't really care one way or the other. If it's possible, it might be nice to keep our options open and have one that we could plug-n-play.

My thinking behind the second carrier was that you can't fly the shuttle everywhere. If we need to just get about town or to escort passengers somewhere we're a little short on vehicles. A carrier for passengers and another one for an escort would be good.  if we ever need to carry out an assault where the shuttle isn't the tool for the job a carrier for troops and another one for support / medivac would be great. it's not a must or anything. It's just that at the movement some people are walking. as for the FGMP, those things irradiate the place. The potential for friendly casualties is pretty high. On top of that, depending on what you read they are as tightly controlled as nuclear weapons. Having some kind of modular arrangement where we could "plug and play" would be handy I guess, but I get the feeling an FGMP would gather dust. Weapons that you don't have to think twice about pulling the trigger on would be a better bet.

It’s a little late to respec the Shuttle and the cruiser just to support an additional G-Carrier. The Air Raft will have to do for luxury passenger transport. Can we please have a reminder of what the Shuttle can currently carry? Agreed on the FGMPs.

Tenacious Techhunter said: It’s a little late to respec the Shuttle and the cruiser just to support an additional G-Carrier. The Air Raft will have to do for luxury passenger transport. Can we please have a reminder of what the Shuttle can currently carry? Agreed on the FGMPs. We don't really need to re-spec anything to take another G-Carrier. The Assault Shuttle can take 2 G-Carriers or 1 G-Carrier plus the Air/raft and the bikes. There is room in the hangar for a G-Carrier aside from the one in the Assault Shuttle.  Personally, I'm ok with whatever you guys want to do with the small craft. Let's just get it all decided and set for tonight so we can launch our new ship and get going.

There is enough room in the ship to have 2 g carriers and an air raft out side the shuttle and still be in the shuttle bay. Personaly i think if we do get another G carrier we should dump the air raft. They are almost useless. 4 people and it is open top, no guns and no armor,  Neither Gerald or Izek are happy with passengers in that piece of civie crap. I mean thoese thing cant even handle the rain, what good are they gunna be to weapons?

VIC e. said: There is enough room in the ship to have 2 g carriers and an air raft out side the shuttle and still be in the shuttle bay. Personaly i think if we do get another G carrier we should dump the air raft. They are almost useless. 4 people and it is open top, no guns and no armor,  Neither Gerald or Izek are happy with passengers in that piece of civie crap. I mean thoese thing cant even handle the rain, what good are they gunna be to weapons? I was actually kind of thinking the same thing.

We need a friendly looking unarmored unweaponed something for casual “around town” errands. I agree that we should get an Air Raft with an enclosed and pressurizable cabin. The ship needs to be able to store all the vehicles unloaded from the shuttle.

Tenacious Techhunter said: We need a friendly looking unarmored unweaponed something for casual “around town” errands. I agree that we should get an Air Raft with an enclosed and pressurizable cabin. The ship needs to be able to store all the vehicles unloaded from the shuttle. Yeah I have to admit that I kinda like idea of the airraft. If it's not being used for passengers we could use if for crew. But if we can't have it I won't cry. about the ship needing to be able to store all the vehicles, I'm pretty sure it could. I imagine that the cargo bay opened directly into the shuttle bay. If we ever needed an empty shuttle for something they could go into cargo.

The hangar is 120 tons.  Assault Shuttle: -90 dT G-Carrier 1: -8 dT G-Carrier 2: -8 dT Bikes: -4.5 dT 110.5 dT used 9.5 dt Remaining Air/Raft: 4 dT Not saying we need them all, just that we can fit them in.

Screw the friendly nice nice g carrier, I WANT A COOOOOOOOOOL looking g-carrier IT IS going to have Armor and even if its a pop up turret its gunna have a gun. If it has no defense or protection  WHY WOULD WE WANT IT? FFS we are a high spec merc company, not some sailor moon conference. If any of our assets cant defend them selves we should replace it with some thing that can.

I think you're failing to see the potential of an air raft vic.  First of all, some times we're going to need a civilian vehicle. Not sure if every posh high rise building we need to land on has the facilities to accomodate a flying tank. In some situations, military vehicles may be totally outside what we need. on top of that, air/rafts are better for recon. Better visibility for all the occupants and I doubt folks pay too much attention to another air/raft floating past. Someone in a grav belt or a flying tank may draw more attention. I agree wi most of what you say though. If there is even a minimal level of risk to our clients we'd load them into a lux G-carrier if we can. And we're not talking about replacing carriers with a air/raft. Just supplementing them.

Air raft = target

I added a "G/Carriers" tab in the Company Docs, with two custom G/Carriers. The first is basically the TL15 military from the Military Vehicles Supplement with a few added features. The second is a "civilian" version, replacing the weapon with a bunch of defenses, improved sensors, luxuries and extreme speed and maneuverability.

Ah ... Okay.  As per your request last meta, I've almost finished knocking up a plan for the two G-Carriers.  One was a support carrier. This one is for medi-vacs and long range fire support. It has cryo pods and is fully kitted out for medical/rescue ops.  The other one was modular. Rigged out with interchangeable fitting so that it can be either a troop carrier or a G-Limo depending on mission. Weapons are on interchangeable cradles.  So she could tote a bug gun, defensive weapons, or no weapon at all with only a bit of time in the shop.  Happy to can this idea in favor of the civ/military idea though. 

Hey, that's cool, too. I hadn't heard anything so I figured I'd get it done. You choose. I do like the idea of being geared up to Rescue & Relief operations.

Speaking of rescue opps, We have 3 people who are good candidates for rescue opps battle dress. The ex rescue dude him self, Thom Hobbs the steward and our doctor. Just a thiught.

I was going to send a PM to you both about this idea actually, but may as well bring it up here. Can't remember if I brought it up before...  I was thinking about a response team that specializes in first aid (medical skill), rescue (mechanical/recon) and passenger liaison (steward). Izek and Taroon leading Janie Growns  Jerey Ugotiga  Piano Man Janie and Piano Man have Battledress skill, so could be equipped with that groovy rescue battledress. Could fit them with laser cutters for when they need to cut through twisted starship wreckage when rescuing folks. When not being Thunderbird style heroes they would be taking care of crew and passengers with their steward and medical skills.  EDIT: Sorry Vic just saw your post. Yeah pretty much what you said. Give those guys the tools they need to be a kickarse rescue team and organize them into a group. 

Replace Izek with Jeff, Jerey has steward covered with a one and a 12 soc. And I have better recon and mechanics skill, I just thought that Jeff would be able to do a better job.

Jeff think would be better in a combat team. We need his recon skill, goggly eye and sharp shoot'n goodness in a fight.  I figured these guys would be focusing on long range support and on rescuing us when things go bad. Out side a fight they'd be the Thunderbirds.  There's a squad of laser rifle toting folks I was hoping Jeff would lead. 

Well for the laser rifle totin team I need jerey, he's great with a gun and I need his mechanics 3 on my team(robots)