How do I, as GM, deal with players who acquired an item far earlier than they were supposed to?

Some background. I started a game in a Star Wars setting a while back. It was my first ever campaign. I've learned quite a bit since then. In the third or so session, I had a great quest set up for my players. Here's what was meant to happen to the low level characters: The Hutt they worked for gives them a mission: To go to the Kaut Drive yards and steal the schematic files for the Star Destroyer Executor. They would then escape by a conveniently placed, unfinished star destroyer in drydock, which would then explode after a hyperspace jump, and force them to crash on the Volcanic world of Sarapin. However, what actually happened was: They stole the plans, boarded my convenient star destroyer and managed to prevent it from exploding with a natural 20 on a repair check. Nowadays, I still wouldn't have let them keep it. But that's beside the point. They now have a mostly complete star destroyer out in deep space. By the way, they're level 3. How can I get this obviously OP ship away from the group of smugglers without just going "rocks fall, ship explodes." I want the players to win, and a personal capital ship would be fine.... At level 15-20. Not at level 3. Any suggestions? My general plan to this point has been to infiltrate their midst with a combat droid sent by a bounty hunter working for the empire to steal the ship back. Anyone think this is a good course of action? It's been about a year since we left off this campaign, due to college for one of the main players taking them across country. But Thanks to Roll20, we may be starting it up again soon. Which means I have to start thinking about how this will work.

ever heard of a self destruct protocol? It would be reasonable for this ship to have one for just this kind of problem, it might involve an agent having to get onto the ship to activate but most groups would rather scuttle the ship then let the "enemy" get it. edit: actually, an enemy agent slipping onboard, starting an obvious self destruct, and getting the **** out might be a fun encounter that the characters could win but which you could reasonable make win conditions where they keep the ship next to impossible. you might also want to consider something as simple as some important machinery not being on-board/installed. ex: "landing gear"

I don't play this game and don't know what published material there is regarding the technology behind an SD. But I would think that the Empire, once they learned of a stolen Star Destroyer, would spare no effort to either recover it or destroy it. Surely they would be able to track the thing and know it's current location, that technology would undoubtedly be built into every Imperial ship for command and control purposes. I think the challenge for your players should be to figure out how to destroy the SD themselves, so that it doesn't fall back into the hands of the Empire, and then get away before an Imperial fleet shows up to reclaim it.

How are the PCs able to crew the Star Destroyer by themselves? One source I've found online suggests it needs upwards of 36,000 people to operate. So while an emergency hyperspace jump somewhere isn't out of the question (and certainly probably within the realm of Star Wars), five or so people aren't going to be able to easily control a mile long spaceship on their own. I'd use the lack of crew as a reason they can't keep the ship. Now, if they can play a few sessions to round up a crew or find a willing buyer, then it's problem solved. In the meantime, you've got a ready source of adventure hooks. "You find the only person qualified to repair that variety of propulsion system is currently incarcerated in the Imperial Prison Camp of Xxzzyz. What do you do?"

ditto on the crew. they would probably take hours to even get it moving, let alone fight it. The Empire would show up and smoke them good. While they are fumbling around legions of space troopers in assault boats board and basically kill them. The best they could hope for is try to self destruct it, and bail in the few minutes between detecting a small flotilla of Star destroyers and being boarded.

Run them ragged with constant repairs and malfunction. That size of spaceship needs constant maintance plus add in the fact that some critical functions do not work because they have not been installed. Have part of the turbolifts not able to go where they need to go because there is no lift there aka it is missing. This will make them figure out how to reach the malfunction without the ease of the lift.

Okay, first off, get off the railroads and don't worry about the fact that your players aren't doing what they were "supposed" to do. Don't just take it away from them because you don't want them to have it. Talk to your players about what they want to do with the star destroyer. Do they want to keep it? What kinds of challenges do they want to see with it? What challenges do they expect with trying to run a star destroyer? What do they want to do with it? It sounds to me like a ragtag group of smugglers who blundered their way into possession of an Imperial Star Destroyer is a very cool premise. Don't waste it.

But it is an uncompleted SD. What I suggest is within reason and it lets them keep the SD but with the problems that come along with it. If they attempt to do a hyperjump they could end up somewhere they were not expecting and have to fingure out where they are and how to get back aka lost in space style. They could have ran out of fuel and now they have to find more, a lot more of it. The opportunities here boggle the mind. There is no reason to let them have a fully functional SD since it was incomplete. Maybe the defense shields don't work or the weapons don't. Exercise the right to make the SD a hinderance they have to figure out how to turn into a bonus.

To me it is not about taking it away, it is about, what happens next? I steal a US battleship. Yeah the marines and SEALs come and shoot me in the noggin. Not I sail around oh so gleefully and start shelling pago pago because I want to own a small country. Cool storyline aside, No Myth aside, it's a battleship, they stole it, the powers that be would work like hell to get it back. now if all they did was Jump way way out to wildspace and have verpine techs and such come aboard, well fine. But tooling around the local area as a spoiler force with a half dozen rebels manning the bridge against a fully crewed Star Destroyer plus tie wings with pilots, it has nothing to do with railroad. Genre conventions, right? Joleur wrote on that 10 years ago.

Back to the OP, an SD is so huge and vastly complex that your possibilities are endless without having to resort to a "rock falls" solution. Searching around on this subject I came across "Wookieepedia" (who knew such a thing existed?) and it claims an Imperial II class Star Destroyer requires a minimum crew of 5000 just to operate, full crew compliment is 37,085. That right there would it impractical for your party of 3rd level characters to possess it for more than the 1 jump you originally intended. Since the SD was still under construction, it probably would not have been outfitted yet. But if you want to give your players options, Wookieepedia claims that a typical SD carries the following compliment of smaller ships: 72 TIE Fighters 8 Lambda-class Shuttles 15 Delta-Class Stormtrooper Transports 5 Assault Gunboats var. GAT-12 Skipray Blastboats 1 Gamma-Class Assault Shuttle There are also 20 ea. AT-ATs, AT-STs and the barges needed to transport them to the surface Without researching the details on these ships, I would think that any one of them would be a huge windfall for a party of low-level characters, and something they could reasonably operate. A reasonable option would be to allow your players to take one of these smaller ships and get out before the might of the Imperial Navy shows up to deal with this renegade SD.

Brett E. said: Back to the OP, an SD is so huge and vastly complex that your possibilities are endless without having to resort to a "rock falls" solution. Searching around on this subject I came across "Wookieepedia" (who knew such a thing existed?) and it claims an Imperial II class Star Destroyer requires a minimum crew of 5000 just to operate, full crew compliment is 37,085. That right there would it impractical for your party of 3rd level characters to possess it for more than the 1 jump you originally intended. Since the SD was still under construction, it probably would not have been outfitted yet. But if you want to give your players options, Wookieepedia claims that a typical SD carries the following compliment of smaller ships: 72 TIE Fighters 8 Lambda-class Shuttles 15 Delta-Class Stormtrooper Transports 5 Assault Gunboats var. GAT-12 Skipray Blastboats 1 Gamma-Class Assault Shuttle There are also 20 ea. AT-ATs, AT-STs and the barges needed to transport them to the surface Without researching the details on these ships, I would think that any one of them would be a huge windfall for a party of low-level characters, and something they could reasonably operate. A reasonable option would be to allow your players to take one of these smaller ships and get out before the might of the Imperial Navy shows up to deal with this renegade SD. Correct and with it being uncompleted the GM is totally within his rights to limit what there is and what can be done. Maybe the SD had only enough fuel for one jump since it was not expected to leave the dock. Food supplies non existant because no one was stationed on the ship aka they all was living in the dock station. Maybe there was a imperial construction crew somewhere on the ship doing some work and they start performing gorilla actions which could include trying to contact any imperial bases near by or broadcasting emergency beacon.

B L. said: Okay, first off, get off the railroads and don't worry about the fact that your players aren't doing what they were "supposed" to do. Don't just take it away from them because you don't want them to have it. Talk to your players about what they want to do with the star destroyer. Do they want to keep it? What kinds of challenges do they want to see with it? What challenges do they expect with trying to run a star destroyer? What do they want to do with it? It sounds to me like a ragtag group of smugglers who blundered their way into possession of an Imperial Star Destroyer is a very cool premise. Don't waste it. Yes, great advice. Your role as GM is to fill their lives with cinematic adventure on par with the Star Wars genre. Find out what sorts of adventures and challenges the players envision while riding around in their new star destroyer and then do that.

A lot of good suggestions. Basically I feel like it comes down to preferring the solution where you "correct" the situation in game by throwing new story and plot hooks at the players over a solution where you just talk to the player/players OOG and tell them that something needs to change (ie. them losing their loved OP item). One thing that I thought I'd just throw out there though is that it sounds like that you use the d20 star wars system? In d20 there is (RAW anyway) no automatic success on a natural roll of 20 on a skill roll. (you may be aware but it sounded like you may have allowed it because of the natural 20) In addition the repair skill states that starship repairs are very complex and would take "hours or even days". So if the players were in a rush it would have been completely legitimate to say that they do not have time to tinker with the ship to prevent the explosion.

Actually, I don't use starwars D20. I was basically just ad-libbing the rules as I went along. Since then, I've developed my own system for Fantasy and Sci-Fi both. Mostly. It's still not finished, but when the essential rules are all set up, I'll probably release it as a beta on roll20. Anyway. Thanks for the suggestions everyone! I've been telling them they should find a crew for a while. However, I still should probably prevent them from executing their plan of having a crew of 6,000 life-debted wookiees or becoming the leader of the Mandalorians by trial by combat with Boba Fett. Oh well. Thanks.

Steven C said: A lot of good suggestions. Basically I feel like it comes down to preferring the solution where you "correct" the situation in game by throwing new story and plot hooks at the players over a solution where you just talk to the player/players OOG and tell them that something needs to change (ie. them losing their loved OP item). What I'm suggesting isn't that you talk to the players about how to take away their item. I'm suggesting talking to your players about what they want to do with it to advance the story. That may be self-destructing the SD and escaping, it may be selling it to the Rebels, it may be finding a crew and doing repairs, etc. Andrew K. said: However, I still should probably prevent them from executing their plan of having a crew of 6,000 life-debted wookiees or becoming the leader of the Mandalorians by trial by combat with Boba Fett. Oh well. Thanks. Why? Those both sound like cool possibilities.

B L. said: Andrew K. said: However, I still should probably prevent them from executing their plan of having a crew of 6,000 life-debted wookiees or becoming the leader of the Mandalorians by trial by combat with Boba Fett. Oh well. Thanks. Why? Those both sound like cool possibilities. Ehh. I guess the wookiees one is more acceptable than the other. But mainly the reason I balk at thtem is I'm a bit of a canon purist for Star Wars. Maybe I should let that slide more in favor of player shenanigans...

Let them get a crew of wookies. I think it would be cool to see them running an imperial SD. Think of the first waves of imperial stormtroopers coming on board running into wookies. I don't think they will appreciate having their arms ripped off.

Don't "let" them do anything. That's not the GM's role. They can choose to do whatever they want within the scope of the genre and your social contract. The GM just facilitates that and fills their lives with adventure. Their actions and the mechanics that come into play as per the rules of the game will determine the outcomes. Where the mechanics don't cover something, then collaborate together on an interesting outcome that advances the story and leads to more adventure. It really is that simple. It is the fundamental loop of RPGs. As to canon, I doubt George Lucas is going to send jackbooted lawyers to your pad to kick in your door and stop you. Stick to the genre expectations (no Starship Enterprises, k?), but otherwise who cares if they kill Boba Fett? Just say your game is now the JJ Abrams version of Star Wars and play to find out what happens with the characters and their prize.

Have you read the other thread about 'punishing' players? Lots of good advice :) I just want to say that if you allow them to have an SD with a crew of wookies you will forever be their hero and they will remember and relate the game forever. I am as a slave to canon as anyone, even if I wrote it myself in a homebrew world. Sometimes you just let the players run with it. I think you recognize the first mistake... allowing them at all to have access to an SD and having ANY possibility to run it. Also, I have learned long ago that even on rolls of 1 or 20 there needs to be some sense to it. Too late now, but the 20 could have allowed them to not start the self-destruct or something. As has been mentioned there are a hundred ways to get rid of it that make sense within game. However, as they have not played in so long they have probably either: A. Fantasized and planned in the off time about what they are going to with their treasure. taking it away right away could start a mutiny unless you really, really explain it well. B. Have realized how crazy it is, and improbable they can actually keep it. So, talking to them is easy enough in this case. Either way, explain the situation but don't make it you vs them for the SD.

I think getting a crew of Wookiees could be an awesome adventure. How would they get thousands of Wookiees to owe them their lives? Perhaps they save Kashyyyk? Maybe liberate an Imperial concentration camp for Wookiees? Maybe they save Life Day? Maybe they bring the head of an infamous Trandoshan slaver?

What would be cool is if during their exploration of the SD that is not functioning properly, they discover a functional ship that is of appropriate size but with limited fuel for their sublight drives but no working hyperdrive. The sensors show there is a planet nearby that the database shows is a forgotten imperial concentration camp. You could populated it with what ever you want and let the players decide what to do. Maybe have it holds a supply base and it contains parts to get the smaller ship's hyperdrive working. This will let them choose to have a floating hidden base while they figure out how to get a crew if that is what they want or lets them start parting out pieces from the SD if they find a fencer for the parts. Everything I said is just a suggestion or two.

As a PnP (Pen and Paper) GM one of my player groups obtained armor that wasn't intended or near impossible to get (turned a bad situation to good). I didn't penalize the player. I did the checks to see if it was cursed etc and I went from there. The same can be said about the uncomplete Star Distroyer. As its incomplete and obviously understaffed this has openings as to what could happen. Craft integrity would be lower (roll a check to find out how much its actually complete) and go from there. Roll checks to see what is actually on board when they jumped. Do they actually make their jump? off course? random planet? As GM its not only fun to tell the story but to also look at possible twists in the story. For those twists do rolls to try and keep it random and unbiased.

David R. said: Roll checks to see what is actually on board when they jumped. Do they actually make their jump? off course? random planet That's a good point... They could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova and that would end their trip real quick now, wouldn't it?

David R. said: As a PnP (Pen and Paper) GM one of my player groups obtained armor that wasn't intended or near impossible to get (turned a bad situation to good). I didn't penalize the player. I did the checks to see if it was cursed etc and I went from there. The same can be said about the uncomplete Star Distroyer. As its incomplete and obviously understaffed this has openings as to what could happen. Craft integrity would be lower (roll a check to find out how much its actually complete) and go from there. Roll checks to see what is actually on board when they jumped. Do they actually make their jump? off course? random planet? As GM its not only fun to tell the story but to also look at possible twists in the story. For those twists do rolls to try and keep it random and unbiased. I think for the GM should talk to his players about what kinds of twists they would be interested in. This would keep it non-random and biased towards cool stuff that the players want to do. So, in this example, it sounds like the players want to crew the ship with Wookies. So, instead of rolling for a random planet and ending up on, say, Tatooine for no reason with nothing the players want to do there, just say they end up on Kashyyyk, or near a planet with an Imperial Wookiee concentration camp.

Brett E. said: David R. said: Roll checks to see what is actually on board when they jumped. Do they actually make their jump? off course? random planet That's a good point... They could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova and that would end their trip real quick now, wouldn't it? "Rocks fall, everyone dies."

B L. said: "Rocks fall, everyone dies." I seriously hope you didn't miss the joke embedded in that post? If you did, you were probably already in over your head the moment you first posted in this thread.

I know nothing of the star wars universe, but perhaps getting the crew and the resources needed to actually fly the thing could be a very substantial quest line. You can't fly it properly yet, so you'll have to store it somewhere the imperials can't find it (my star trek knowledge says nebula or between two binary stars) Perhaps later on a small trader happens to come across your ship, he knows it's worth and the PCs have to decide what to do with him. Getting enough fuel to power a freckin' huge battleship sounds like a few gaming sessions. I'm guessing you'd have to find a suitable space port, work out where the fuel is stored, find a way to steal it and then find a way of getting the fuel back to the ship. Getting the crew is another mission, a full crew of wookies sounds great, but you might want a couple of specialists there too. Perhaps they could get the retired weapons officer to work for them etc. You might also need an imperial quantum matrix flux thingy as well, it's a shame they are only stored in high security imperial facilities. Perhaps you have to track down a local smuggler who can get you into the base or get you some form of ID cards. The problem is that he's only on that planet/city/space station for 3 days. If you don't manage to find your items in that time - you've got to go with out it, or, face being abandoned. With suitable set backs and other sub-plots/quests coming along you may well find that it takes them many levels before it's actually usable. Then it's not so OP for their level. At this point they've done lots of stuff and got a reward (a working ship) but perhaps the ship doesn't have fully working weapons, shields etc. So these are further quests they can do. Finally of course they have to pick their fights very carefully, perhaps they could break into an imperial communications satellite to monitor messages in the region so they can always stay ahead of the imperial hunt to find them. Or, perhaps they could fake the destruction of their ship to stop the imperials looking for it.

Brett E. said: B L. said: "Rocks fall, everyone dies." I seriously hope you didn't miss the joke embedded in that post? If you did, you were probably already in over your head the moment you first posted in this thread. What, because I don't remember every line from Star Wars, I'm too stupid to help someone out with his problem?

B L. said: What, because I don't remember every line from Star Wars, I'm too stupid to help someone out with his problem? No one here has called you stupid. But when you make snarky comments towards someone don't be surprised when they fire back, sport.

Hey everyone, we have been having a good discussion and have been mostly polite to each other so can I recommend we stay civil and polite before the mods come in and whup on us with their modsticks +5 then shutdown this thread.