Finding the best game for my friends

I am looking for a game to play with friends and Have hit a dead end so to speak. My group has many new to Roleplaying Games or are very far from Veteran. We have played 3.5/Pathfinders they enjoy the game but I can tell they are struggling with the mechanics and how to solve puzzles. I would like to find a game that has great combat, and simplified characters. My goal is to help them get more into the mind set of playing the role so the less rules they need to remember the better. Any genre is ok, it does not have to be medieval fantasy

Powered by the Apocalypse system looks perfect. I will have to take a look at the classes more. If I can let them make their own classes all the better.

Professor Loophole said: I would like to find a game that has great combat, and simplified characters. My goal is to help them get more into the mind set of playing the role so the less rules they need to remember the better. Any genre is ok, it does not have to be medieval fantasy Barbarians of Lemuria is a neat little system if you have a sword and sorcery bent. It's based each character having "careers" instead of classes, so you wind up with a mini-lifepath system at the end. Hard to get any simpler than really old-school indluenced games like Swords and Wizardry. Especially considering you and your players are familiar with all of the concepts from Pathfinder.

There's always just not worrying about getting the rules right. And I wouldn't mistake Dungeon World as particularly rules light.

In response to Paul U. While I am a firm believer in what the GM/DM says goes, it is better to play a game more to the speed of the group then just break a game to "fit". It also hinders letting other take charge and make their own stories if they dont actually know how to play.

Professor Loophole said: My goal is to help them get more into the mind set of playing the role so the less rules they need to remember the better. If rules-lite is your primary criteria, you might consider Basic D&D (Moldvay, 1981). The entire rule book is only 64 pages, and that's for both the DM and the players. $5 will get you a .pdf copy here: <a href="http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/110274/D%26D" rel="nofollow">http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/110274/D%26D</a>...

I dont think dusting off an older version of of the game they are struggling with is the solution to the problem at hand.

Well, you asked for rules-lite and it's definitely that. But if you're not interested, no worries. Just trying to help.

Look into the D6 system. Originally it was done by WEG games (with fantasy, sci-fi, and modern, star wars, and a few other games), but is now an open system with several rewrites that include various levels of crunch and other genres. It is an easily adaptable, easy to learn system, it is not level-based (not a criteria, but I thought it worth mentioning), and seems like it might be what you are looking for. Many of the versions have free PDF downloads. Professor Loophole said: I dont think dusting off an older version of of the game they are struggling with is the solution to the problem at hand. BD&D and D&D 3.5/Pathfinder are about as similar as cricket and baseball (they certainly share traits, but are not the same game). Now it might not be the best solution for you, but it is certainly an easier/more streamlined game than 3.5/Path (and a very good suggestion if the only thing you didn't like about D&D was all of the crunch/rules). I wasn't sure if you were dismissing it out of hand, thinking it was the same game, or if you were familiar with it and didn't want to play it. Also look into OSR games; many have the rules-light feeling of OD&D, but incorporate a lot of concepts in 3.5 D&D. Some of these changes include: ascending AC, BAB, d20/style ability checks, etc. Some exclusions might be: feats, skills, attack-of-opportunities, grid-based combat, etc. One advantage to starting from a rules-lite version of D&D is that it is very easy to add things in (such as pathfinder skills) without having the cascading effect of houserules in a complex system such as D&D 3.5. Many OSR games have free PDF downloads that you can read through before purchasing in-print copies. If you go the OSR route, stay away from games that draw their inspiration from AD&D such as OSRIC (while still simpler than D&D 3.5, they are far from rules-light).

The Basic Fantasy Role-Playing Game is a rules-light game system modeled on the classic RPG rules of the early 1980's. Though based loosely on the d20 SRD v3.5, Basic Fantasy RPG has been written largely from scratch to replicate the look, feel, and mechanics of the early RPG game systems. It is suitable for those who are fans of "old-school" game mechanics. Basic Fantasy RPG is simple enough for children in perhaps second or third grade to play, yet still has enough depth for adults as well.

Now that I tossed out my chosen system. What genre are you all interested? Fantasy might not be something that they are interested so if you can tell us what type of genre that you all like to read / watch / play video games, etc we can help better.

Kristin C. said: Paul U. said: There's always just not worrying about getting the rules right. And I wouldn't mistake Dungeon World as particularly rules light. In comparison to D&D 3.5/Pathfinder? It's light in my book. No, in comparison to Fiasco and Fate. Edit: I just don't think the "lightness" of Dungeon World should be oversold. It's subtle and needs to be run in a very particular way.

I have seen some games of D6 I like the system, but havent seen anything using it that system that stood out. Any recommendations?

As stated in the original post any genre is fine, Sci Fi, Fantasy, Western, Horror, ect

If you want to use the d6 system I'd suggest the Star Wars D6 2nd Edition, if your friends are new to the hobby, using something familiar like a popular film will make the transition easy, if no one watched star wars, in which case you should get new friends , there is also a Men In Black D6, and a Ghostbusters D6. In fact I'm sure DrivethruRPG is selling the basic Fantasy, Adventure, and Space D6 Modules for free!

D6 space is awesome. The only other one I am very familiar with is mini-six by anti-paladin games. Mini-six is probably too light for most people, but it has rules for converting D6 core material to Mini-six (and expanding the 4 attributes to give a little more detail). So if the standard D6 games are too heavy, I would recommend starting with Mini-six and adding complexity from the regular games until it suites you. I have heard there are a lot of other great D6 games since it went open (for various genres with tons of flavor), but I am not familiar enough with any of them to make any kind of recommendation.

Tree Ant said: The only other one I am very familiar with is mini-six by anti-paladin games. Mini-six is probably too light for most people, but it has rules for converting D6 core material to Mini-six (and expanding the 4 attributes to give a little more detail). Mini Six is another good choice - really streamlined and does what it sets out to do.

D&D Basic, AD&D, Swords&Wizardry and other "original" dnd knock offs are the best. Simple rules, you can focus on RP as much as you like. And compared to other systems mentioned here, whereby the game tries to "show you how to RP" and has "RP stats", 1st edition D&D has only a few combat stats and charisma that everyone starts to care less and less about after a while, you are free to RP as you wish.

Professor Loophole said: I am looking for a game to play with friends and Have hit a dead end so to speak. My group has many new to Roleplaying Games or are very far from Veteran. We have played 3.5/Pathfinders they enjoy the game but I can tell they are struggling with the mechanics and how to solve puzzles. I would like to find a game that has great combat, and simplified characters. My goal is to help them get more into the mind set of playing the role so the less rules they need to remember the better. Any genre is ok, it does not have to be medieval fantasy "Professor Loophole" - cool name! Sounds like a supervillain. My response is going to be aimed at helping you determine your group's priorities so you can choose a game rather than just telling you what game to play. Teach a man to fish, as they say. First, the mechanics of 3.5/Pathfinder represent gamist and simulationist priorities. If the players enjoy that, but aren't into the granularity of the rules, you might want to search for games with similar creative agenda but which are rules lite. (Puzzles are actually a test of the players, not the characters and have nothing to do with the particular game system. If they're struggling with them, you can just take them out.) It is notable that system mastery is an expected challenge of 3.5/Pathfinder and is part of the game itself. Given time, your players should develop system mastery and in the doing achieve one of the goals of playing that system as well as the rewards that come with it (i.e. building more effective characters and engaging in more coherent tactics). Learning the game system is also the responsibility of everyone playing the game (see rule #6 in particular). Next, getting "more into the mind set of playing the role" has very little to do with the complexity of the rules system and more about engaging with the emotional identification of the characters. This doesn't require rules at all, but may be easier if the rules themselves help achieve this goal. This is known by some as the Immersion Hurdle . My point here is that achieving your goal of additional immersion doesn't require less rules per se, just rules that help you identify with the character. The article will show you in further detail what I mean. As was mentioned in the creative agenda link above, great games come out of a basic understanding of the group of what it is the group is trying to achieve and then setting out to achieve it. This is true regardless of system - the long and short of it is that the group needs to be on the same page for the game to go well. You clearly have some ideas about what you want for your group. But does your group want what you want? Consider this: A Way Out . And then maybe this tool can be of help with getting your group on the same page so that you can collectively make some decisions about the game you're going to ultimately play. Finally, there were a couple mentions of Dungeon World . While I love that game, my love for it is, in part, because of my gaming priorities which is unabashedly narrativist . I'm not sure what your creative agenda is, but if you're on the simulationist end of the spectrum, getting used to running and playing a narrativist game is going to be a huge challenge. It looks and smells like D&D, but brother, it ain't . All manner of different GM techniques are required to play it and the players (depending on the game) may be taking on authorship and directorship roles as well which may be completely foreign to your group. Anyone used to D&D is going to be frustrated when the rules completely fight you at every turn as you're trying to run it. So ultimately, my advice in choosing a game is to figure out your creative agenda, get on the same page with your group, then choose a game that meets those needs. (For funsies, I'm guessing that Savage Worlds is that game, actually. Please let me know if after you've discussed it I was right!) Good luck! (Edit: None of the links above are my blogs, but they're good and written by very smart people. If you like their offerings, I recommend following them!)

Super Villain is such a suggestive term lol On past game nights players spent more time looking up parts of their characters then trying to interact. This meant time in towns was brief and just exposition dumps by the DM. When we were fighting there was no imagination to how they tried to fight, just stab it till it dies. These same players playing Munchkin for the first time were manipulative to each other, exploited the cards, and knew when to be quite to keep attention off of themselves. They have the right mindeset to play characters in an RPG they just get swept up in the rules to let the creative (and in the case of munchkin, evil) juices flow. Thats why I am seeking a RPG that would have less rules so they can grasp it quicker and have fun. While yes eventually they will have a better understanding of DnD I rather play a game their speed and Have fun they try to convince everyone to play a game they are struggling with.

I can speak with them but, from what some have told me as they rant the current DM is boring and unhelpful(and he is unhelpful) I can tellthey are focusing in on trying to learn the game then play it.

Unknown Armies is pretty simple for players, so long as you're running a street-level campaign (where it's not recommended to permit Adepts and Avatars, the "casters" of the setting). Each player has 5 stresses, 4 attributes, 3 passions, and a number of skills under each attribute (limited by your rating in each attribute). With one exception that only applies to Adepts (and only rarely), all actions are d%, roll under attribute/skill as appropriate. If the roll is for the character's one skill marked as their obsession, the player can flip the digits of the roll (eg, 51 becomes 15). Once per session per passion, if the passion applies to the situation (GM discretion), the player can either flip-flop the roll, or reroll. For mundane characters, that's the large majority of what they need to know. (There's other stuff, like combat timing, car chases, etc. but IME those sort of rules can be learned during gameplay rather than memorized at the start.) The GM does need more intimate knowledge of the setting and rules than that, so if the GM needs simplicity as well, then it wouldn't be the greatest choice. FWIW, players have a lot of freedom in selecting skills and passions. ("A lot of freedom" as in "pick absolutely anything that fits.") As an example, here's some of "Big Steve" from one of the published one-shots: Rage: Betrayal Fear: Being alone Noble: Kind and generous to waifs and strays Body: Athletics, Chasing, Thuggery Speed: Dodge, Drive, Shoot Things Mind: General Education, Notice, Sports Fan Soul: Charm, Intimidate, Lie From the same adventure, Christine Rice has the Body skill "Stay Up All Night" and Eric Goodborough has the Body skill "Fake Seizure." Alex Abel (major NPC in the canon setting) has a skill "Making Gobs of Money." Even the skills which players are given for free, you're encouraged to fluff up as appropriate for the character; everyone gets "Struggle," but Big Steve has "Thuggery" instead, for example. Steve has "Chasing" instead of "Run," while Steve's boss has "Run Away." Adepts and Avatars can get complicated for the player, though not all are on the same level. Generating minor charges for a Dipsomancer is pretty simple (Dipsomancers aren't called "Booze Hounds" for nothing.) An Entropomancer has to put in a bit more effort to generate a minor charge, even if they might come away from it with only a wounded pride, rather than a wounded liver.

You should have a look at the playtest rules for D&D Next, free and simple.

Someone PM me a great idea, Paranoia. As long as we stick to Red Clearance the game wont be too complicated, but more importantly its a game where they will be backstabbing each other as well as having to work together to survive the computers requests.

Oh yeah, Paranoia the only game where I was able to use a giant fighting robot to battle a communist Cthulhu monster

I would add another suggestion for a bit more serious game then Paranoia: BareBones Fantasy or Covert Ops by DWD Studios. Immensly enjoyable, easy to understand based on a % system. Some smart ideas in there too. It uses Classes as Skills instead of a normal skill system. Very clever and easy to run and play. I can not reccomend it enough. And it is 10$ for the game, including all rules and monster manual etc. <a href="http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/browse.php?manufacturers_id=3515" rel="nofollow">http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/browse.php?manufacturers_id=3515</a> Also: Savage Worlds. Not quiet as easy or streamlined but even more adaptable.