Token Vision vs Light

So while updating a token's light ranges to account for darkvision and a torch, I found a gap in the current lighting system.

• Darkvision range = 60'
• Emits Light: 60 / 0
• All Players See Light: no
• Torch range = 40'
• Emits Light: 40 / 20
• All Players See Light: yes

So with the current lighting system, if a character with darkvision lights a torch, the lighting on the character's token would lose the range of their darkvision. In this scenario, the token can start emitting light (All Players See Light: yes) to a range of 40' but the token loses its darkvision (All Players See Light Vision: no) range of 60' (thus losing 20' of vision).

The current system has no way to account for a token's vision (All Players See Light Vision: no) while also accounting for a light source on the token (All Players See Light: yes).

I would like to see two sources of light / vision for a token.

• Vision (All Players See Light Vision: no)
• Emits Light (All Players See Light: yes) 

I wholly agree that this should be addressed. Currently the only workaround is having a separate token with the light, but this becomes a burden when I already struggle to move multiple selected objects at once.

So, yes, this is an issue. I've encountered it myself.

But, my 'explanation' of this has been that lighting the torch ruins the darkvision, just like when you get a flashlight shined in your eyes after they've adjusted to the dark- totally removes your ability to see in the dark if there's a really bright light source nearby.

But I agree that it's annoying that to give a character darkvision, the current best method is only a 'workaround.'

As a pro user, you also have access to the carry script which is useful for creatures carrying a torch or riding an animal.

Using second token for players with light only shouldn't be that much a problem, unless they abuse it by moving with torh only. And is good when they drop that torch to ground or put it on the wall, you don't have to guess how much they can see in that situation, and no need to create token for torch.

As a player managing two tokens is annoying, cumbersome, and detracts from the overall experience.

As a DM managing two tokens is annoy, cumbersome, and largely distracting.

I've been using this system for a long time, and it's less than ideal...regardless of someone's role in a game.

Also use a Carry API, but for F2P players - this is a huge issue. Having to "remember" 2 seperate sets of "visions" IS a pain. I had to play that game with the token vision on off thing before I found the right API. Even then, Someone with Dark Vision 60ft (with a multiplier of 2 for seeing light) holding a torch 40/20 can see 80 (since darkvision doubles out light) but those without still only see the 40. It gets convoluted after a while trying to balance it out per token.

You should also look at the TokenMod API. It lets you modify parts of a token. You could then add macro buttons on the token to set its vision back and forth between darkvision, torch, lantern, etc.

Or have all your players be warlocks with Devil's Sight. makes everything more straightforward. ;-)

I use TokenMod and API scripts to manage this more easily. The problem is that when light that all players can see (like a torch) typically has a smaller radius than the player's darkvision¹.

This results in all players seeing the light accurately, but the player that is carrying the torch losing 20' of radius.

1. Using D&D 5e ruleset

Why not just change the light radius to 60' dim at 40 so that way you still get the darkvision and the torch light? so you gain the 40 of bright light from the torch and darkvision and the extra 20' of dim from the darkvision.

Then all the players get the bonus darkvision distance.

yep, forgot about that.

Brian C. said:

Then all the players get the bonus darkvision distance.

bsleazy said:

Make a torch token, set it's light radius to appropriate, group with your PC token, ???, profit!

I play tested this a bit but found it not feasible, due to lag the token that is latched on, will lag behind sooner or later, or get stuck on a dyn.light pixel. To account for this problem them gm has to ungroup them, adjust properly and group them again. A little bit cumbersome.

I'm pretty sure the new Dynamic Lighting that's in the works will resolve all my concerns.

i have been playing with Token Mod and Torch all weekend and I must be getting something wrong because neither is working for me. I have been trying to build macros that I can allow the players to use as token actions to adjust their own vision settings.

Reading through this thread, and I believe all the points asked for are part of Updated Dynamic Lighting. The Help Center has a specific example of a carried light source with vision.

Kenton said:

Reading through this thread, and I believe all the points asked for are part of Updated Dynamic Lighting. The Help Center has a specific example of a carried light source with vision.

Correct. Updated Dynamic Lighting addresses and will likely resolve all initially mentioned suggestions.

Maybe I am dense but I do not see how the example in the Help Center addresses the original issue. While the section is titled "Carried Light Sources (With Vision)," the text within it actually says

This can be any static source of light, from wall sconces to street lights. Since they won't be moving, these lights are best represented as new tokens on the Map layer.

This text seems to run counter to the idea of a "carried" light source. Carried light sources will move, and will need to be on the Objects and Tokens layer for players to move them.

The "solution" here is nothing new: making a new token for the light source (torch, lantern, etc.). But this means the player will have to move two tokens each time to keep them together. There is no way (short of an API script) to have a single token emit light and have a separate, independent vision setting at the same time. Or am I missing something?

With Updated Dynamic Lighting, each token has Vision and Light as distinct values. Additionally, each Token has Night Vision.

The current system has no way to account for a token's vision (All Players See Light Vision: no) while also accounting for a light source on the token (All Players See Light: yes).

The three values allow for this request, and a bit more.

Thanks for the confirmation, PapaWhiskey11. I'll close this thread to free up the votes.