Looking for a Realistic game.

Looking for a game where all combat is realistic or one with no combat. As such a sword, Gun or lazer to the arm will leave a wound rather than take points of damage and death occur because of real things that would kill you rather than loss of points. I am also after a game that is focused on character Development, Heavy Role play and story. I am free most times and I can learn any systems needed. I am not fused about what time period it is set in.

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Games are games: they tend to be cinematic rather than realistic. Every attempt I have ever seen at developing a realistic game system has always tended to be deathly dull, and basically no fun to play. Its better to accept that not every point of a given system is 'realistic' (a pointless Holy Grail , with no points of agreement between any two people). I've lost count of the number of GM's I've seen who've tried to impose their view of 'realism' in combat, and which slow the game or the play down to a snails pace. The players tend not to agree with the GMs tunnel vision in such instances. Who wants to play lying in a hospital bed for 6 months? Playability is more valuable than realism. Its better just to find a good GM and players you can get along with, and a system that is failly clean. Rely on good story telling and a decent GM rather than a fruitless vision of system perfection.

I played in a game that used a somewhat realistic combat system for damage. Each limb was 10% of the hp while the head was 5% and the rest was the body then there was a hit location chart. If the character took half the % of hp at that location then something happened. If it was a limb, it was disabled, if it was the body then internal bleeding, if it was the head, the character could have been knocked unconscious. There was other things but that was the basics of it. It truly made you leery of combat.

The mechwarrior system was extremely unforgiving and had a similar mechanic to what you're looking for. Bleeding was a huge issue, as even a minor shot or stab could be fatal. I agree with swampedbybyunnies though: once you've tried to build a "realistic" system it becomes damn near impossible to do anything. Combat in oWOD could be extremely frightening to Mages, for instance, so as the power level increased, the players became quite paranoid about the lone sniper scenario that ended a 2 year campaign. It leads to a lot (and I mean a lot) of planning before anything gets attempted, which has an upside and a downside.

You are bother right, when it comes to being bogged down with hundreds of specific rules. I am after a game where the GM runs the rules as it is far easier to run the game when the rules rely on common sense rather than a book. If anyone knows a game, I would join.

just roll a d4 when taking a wound. flesh wound serious wound - bleed out in 1d6 minutes lethal wound - bleed out in under a minute fatal wound - you're dead This would let you add any descriptive text you want to any attack. If you want to have flesh wound happen more than the other wounds then increase the die to 1d6 and give the flesh wound 1-3 rating. Quick and easy now because either you are slightly hurt, hurt bad enough to be out of the fight, or you are dead.

123Mind123 is right the mechwarrior games were unforgiving especially if the GM uses the optional hit location tables. It became possible to die the first time you got hit. The thing with hit points and damage in other games is that you aren't supposed to represent it by taking dozens of arrows or gun shots to the chest etc. Most of the time it is just grazes or light wounds. If you take large amounts of damage in one shot then it is your character getting shot etc. So in the end as it has been mentioned it all comes down to the DM. Some people like the concept where your character is getting hacked to pieces and still living others play a more realistic game.

Systems that approach this sort of simulation: TSR - Boot Hill TSR - Top Secret, 1st edition (Though there are "Luck Points" to keep it cinematic / survivable. Victory Games - James Bond RPG (but has Luck Points) Eden Studios - Conspiracy X 1st Edition - Very deadly wound system, a little complicated. (Surprisingly) Cubicle 7 - One Ring RPG. There is a stash of endurance points, but if you get run through you are wounded, two wounds kills a PC, wounded and all endurance lost kills a PC. Timeline, Ltd. - Morrow Project, very deadly, most shots will cripple or sever a limb. As I recall, the West End Games' Price of Freedom was pretty deadly. Traveller, as an SFRPG, uses points, but they are applied as wounds, so much so that you don't really want to get into combat unless you need to, because PCs die really fast unless armored. The relative balance between points and the damage that weapons do is pretty harsh. A player character can get clubbed to death, by two guys in an alley. One shot with a shotgun or laser rifle pretty much kills or incapacitates so badly that the PC needs immediate medical assistance. Overall, the system you are looking for does not really exist. If it did, all the simulationist GMs would flock to it. In the end, all that matters is the narrative. Games like LEading Edge's Phoenix Command RPG, and the Aliens RPG are the top end of simulation, as millimeter by millimeter, mechanically simulation what a weapon does as it passes through. Slightly less than that, Task Force Games' Delta Force RPG. Need real world tactics to simulate special forces raids, but it's really steeped in that actual meat and potatoes of close quarters battles and "room-clearing". Middle of the road game that tries anything like simulation, but its very playable would be in my mind, Boot Hill, pretty much if you get shot with a pistol and it doesn't pass through your heart, liver, or spleen, you'll probably make it, if you don't bleed out over the next few days, and can get a doc to sew your PC up, and infection doesn't set in. Bottom of fast play but sloppy realism is probably Twilight:2000. Lots of real world weapons, and PCs get hurt, but they can shake it off, action movie-style. Uses points, but the relative balance is for the PCs as action heroes, easy to kill bad guys, the PCs survive what amounts to "Grazes", to keep the story going.

Trollkin said: Systems that approach this sort of simulation: TSR - Boot Hill TSR - Top Secret, 1st edition (Though there are "Luck Points" to keep it cinematic / survivable. Timeline, Ltd. - Morrow Project, very deadly, most shots will cripple or sever a limb. Traveller LEading Edge's Phoenix Command RPG I played all those games many years ago and I had forgotten about how deadly they are till you mentioned them. I played the Living Steel game that was the forerunner of the Phoenix Command and that combat system was deadly. I had a pc in power armor get his arm blown off and almost die so that is a rather deadly system. I never got to play much of the Morrow Project even though I use to have almost every book for it.

Runequest 6. That is all.

GURPS will provide, imho, the most realistic combat system. The rules are detailed , but playable, tactics are realistic, and combat is very dangerous. There are a good number of "dials" the dm can tweak to adjust the deadliness and complexity. For example and average unarmored character will be laid low by a stab with a sword. Unconscious and bleeding. Guns are bad news. (just like in rl). Here is a link to get the free lite version of the rules to check it out. <a href="http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/Lite/" rel="nofollow">http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/Lite/</a> Good luck and enjoy !

Ok people. I am not looking for rules. I am looking for something more open than that. A game where the DM chooses what should and shouldn't be and there is no obsessively looking at books or wiki links. A game that is realistic because it is run on common sense. That is what I am after. And when it comes to combat, it should be treated like everything ells. Roleplayed.

Oh, sorry then. I don't know of any game that is played that way. Good luck on your hunt.

Thanks

Take a look at A Dirty World . If you want to hear what it's like in play, you can listen to this actual play by RPPR (they actually have several Dirty World actual plays , but I just chose the shortest one for you). If you like it, Better Angels is played in a similar way (but with super powers). Here's my best crack at explaining the system: It's basically a system where you slide chips off of certain attributes if an attack lands. This might not make sense unless you read the book, but basically you have a system of linked attributes and they all have (for lack of a better term) a number of poker chips associated with them (the more you have the better you are at that attribute). When you make an attack on someone you target one of their minor attributes (which is paired up with another minor attribute), if you succeed they slide one of their chips from that minor attribute to it's paired attribute (or if you're really successful the chip can just disappear). Then each minor attribute is linked to a major attribute. And once you've hit someone enough to take their minor attribute down to zero chips you can then attack their major attribute until it hits zero. Depending on which major attribute that is, there's some effect -- if you zero out their Patience they fly into a rage, or if you zero out their Vigor they're incapacitated and can be killed. So if we're talking about a fight to the death it would look like this: 1) You would attack a player's Courage which is a minor attribute linked to their Vigor. Each time you hit them a point slides off of courage and onto their wrath (but each attribute can only hold 5 chips, so if wrath is full the chip just disappears). If I were the GM I would interpret these hits as being either near misses that freak the person out and make them less courageous, or as a hit that connects and does minor damage but also makes them less courageous. 2) Once you're done with Courage you can Vigor which is their vitality and strength. So each time you hit, it does the same thing as above -- a chip from Vigor slides over to Grace. Once a person hit zero Vigor they are out of the fight. As a GM I interpret these as shots that hit and stagger the person a bit. They make them less strong and more focused on the flight reflex, which is why Grace goes up. So if it's a gun fight then a bullet hits but it's a flesh wound and their not completely knocked out of the fight (until they hit zero Vigor) and they're not unable to run away. Once they hit zero they are unable to run away and unable to defend themselves from a killing blow. Also, you should note that the system is made for Noir type games. So characters start off weak, and get their asses kicked all the time, but each time they loss a fight or get lied to they can increase the number of chips they have and they stronger. So in the last scene they're suddenly a bad ass. But it's also definitely a game where the story should come first, and then maybe you roll some dice.

123mind123 said: Ok people. I am not looking for rules. I am looking for something more open than that. A game where the DM chooses what should and shouldn't be and there is no obsessively looking at books or wiki links. A game that is realistic because it is run on common sense. That is what I am after. And when it comes to combat, it should be treated like everything ells. Roleplayed. The only system I can think of that's close to what you're thinking is Fudge RPG <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fudge_(role-playing_g" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fudge_(role-playing_g</a>... Basically more of a freeform roleplaying system.