Language.

I have noticed that in some games profanity/cursing happens, but is not addressed. As Christians we are to be lights and cities on hills. We are also called to congregate and build each other up. I pray that we may abstain as much as possible because it is not only irritating to listen to, but especially since we are to be representatives of Christ. Verses concerning foul language: Ephesians 4:29; Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear. 1 Peter 3:10; For “Whoever desires to love life and see good days, let him keep his tongue from evil and his lips from speaking deceit; (James 3:9-12) 9 With it we bless our Lord and Father, and with it we curse people who are made in the likeness of God. 10 From the same mouth come blessing and cursing. My brothers,these things ought not to be so. 11 Does a spring pour forth from the same opening both fresh and salt water? 12 Can a fig tree, my brothers, bear olives, or a grapevine produce figs? Neither can a salt pond yield fresh water.

Ok, so list the language that is offensive and the deciet might be tough due to roleplaying ideas. This will be tough but I will try in my talk, excluding roleplaying scenarios is that fine?

Personally, I don't think foul language is ever necessary, even when "roleplaying."  Even if you're playing a character who would be using foul language in a certain scene, you can always use a more descriptive approach, "he starts yelling obscenities."  Regan is right, we are called to a different standard.

Personality I don't want to hear any swearing, period for any reason. But I don't like the "i'm in character" excuse for any reason anyway. That is just a cheap excuse for something they know is going to make someone else mad. 

Consider creative approaches that avoid actual obscenity. Something that would enhance the FR experience would be great. For example... Dwarf: What in Moradin's name is going on here?! Wizard exclamation: Sulfuric phosphorous added to copper sulfate and every other thing I hate! Orc: You scrawny elf-lookin poor excuse for a human! Elf: Speaking rapidly and feverishly in Elven on and on until running out of breath. Have fun with it but avoid obscenity at all costs. If anyone struggles with habitual obscenity, let us know and we will exercise patience while helping remind you. I struggled with this years ago and it really helped me overcome it by having accountability.

What about the deceit and stealing that some characters do? 

That, my good sir, is not audible to real life ears and also if you have a Lawful character then maybe they could have a "talk" after seeing this occur. (Personally my characters mostly never try to lie or steal, but the neutral good ones may lie in dire circumstances to save lives)

I mean it could be as if your character sees this wickedness and tries to teach them those verses from his disassembled Bible. Language however is actually a sin that must be done in a VERBAL game, whilst fake stealing and lying to non-real people is not how I would want to portray most characters of mine, it is not as if I have committed it in real life. I would like to exercise caution as we may think that playing corrupt characters may not affect us at all, but if someone cannot tell differences between the game and real life then it would be dangerous,

Oh and Michael I was not specifying individuals as I have heard more than one and could not remember them all anyways lol. Thank you for holding yourself accountable though, because it shows an understanding of truthfulness resting inside you.

So a lawful good character flatter an enemy to get a better advantage over him is considered lying?

Michael S. said: So a lawful good character flatter an enemy to get a better advantage over him is considered lying? Not in my book. Lying has nothing at all to do with chaotic or lawful. Lying comes in to play as good or evil depending on why you are doing it. Selfish reason would lean neutral or even evil if it was harming them. Chaotic or lawful deals with whose law or authority you follow. Are you Robin Hood and steal but give it to the poor. Robin disregards the law of the land but he follows his on moral code. Or are you the Lawful Knight who follows King John even if the king is a lowlife. He is the rightful King. &nbsp;&nbsp; This is a debate tread from one of the boards on 5e I like to read. It talks about LG and CG.&nbsp; <a href="http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-235669.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-235669.html</a>

Lawful Neutral follows Law no matter what. Lawful Good will not follow evil rulers even if they were good at first. These are the actual differences.

I agree with the not cursing, but we might be over thinking some of the rest. I dont think we should be doing evil campaigns at all, but that is my personal thought on it.

I too do not like playing evil campaigns or games where you are the evil guy.

What about a spying campaign?

Interesting the DMG does mention other campaign types such as, mystery (Murder solving), puzzle solving, political, gothic horror, etc.... Most campaigns tend to try to balance combat and RP, but sadly puzzle solving and murder investigations and other types rarely show themselves. Hack and slash or dungeon delving seems to be the predominant type.

Using foul language during role-play is still using foul language in real life. Stealing an imaginary item from an imaginary person is not really stealing. As a DM of almost 25 years, I have dealt with some difficult situations. I have had people play their characters in such a way that made the experience not enjoyable for the rest of the group because "that is what my character would do". The object here is to play your character true to who they are without disrupting the gaming experience for others.&nbsp; This creates a creative challenge for every player but when it is done, it is a LOT of fun. Ideally, each player would role-play in such a way that entertains the other players and the DM. That is the goal.&nbsp; I have seen some pretty interesting ways of resolving this. Here are some examples of what I have seen players do... A barbarian that would not take leadership in a group that had a lack of direction played was played by a player that wanted to help keep things moving. So, he had the "impatient" and "short-tempered" flaws that caused him to rush away from the group into danger. He essentially led the group and kept them on task... in character.&nbsp; A character with a low intelligence that would "accidentally" figure things out in a way that made absolutely no sense logically was hysterical on a regular basis.&nbsp; I could go on... Figure out how to play your characters in a way that would not be offensive to others, but instead entertaining. That is what makes for a great gaming experience.&nbsp;

agreed.

Mike said: Michael S. said: So a lawful good character flatter an enemy to get a better advantage over him is considered lying? Not in my book. Lying has nothing at all to do with chaotic or lawful. Lying comes in to play as good or evil depending on why you are doing it. Selfish reason would lean neutral or even evil if it was harming them. Chaotic or lawful deals with whose law or authority you follow. Are you Robin Hood and steal but give it to the poor. Robin disregards the law of the land but he follows his on moral code. Or are you the Lawful Knight who follows King John even if the king is a lowlife. He is the rightful King. &nbsp;&nbsp; This is a debate tread from one of the boards on 5e I like to read. It talks about LG and CG.&nbsp; <a href="http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-235669.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-235669.html</a> Also in most of the Honor Codes for Lawful characters Lying is always wrong, but on the Chaotic or Neutral Good one lying is acceptable in certain situations.

I use <a href="http://easydamus.com/alignment.html" rel="nofollow">http://easydamus.com/alignment.html</a>&nbsp; when anything pertains to alignment because it portrays them in a much more truthful and coherent way than debate threads where people are arguing different views.

What about Bio and ideals and goals, Gilth&nbsp;bio is making a city where half-elfs, half-orcs, tieflings, and lesser creatures can coexist peacefully. However he would almost anything to make that dream come true and he knows that other leaders and factions would not allow such a place to exist?

What leaders and factions that are good would not allow that to exist?

Each different faction had their own ideals and goals. The lord's alliance main goal is to unite people through trade right? It does not say it will protect the minority does it? You should read all the factions and organizations and ask yourself will they go beyond what thier&nbsp;goals and ideals for the greater good? I think not.

There's a difference between "allowing" and "going beyond". The Lord's Alliance would probably not pursue that goal, specifically, but that doesn't mean that they would oppose it. That being said, if the governing body were opposed to that, they might be considered lawful neutral or even lawful evil, and therefore be opposed by a lawful good character. However, a lawful good character would oppose them directly, without subterfuge, because that would not be honorable. Someone that opposed such a government with deceit and subterfuge, for the greater good would be chaotic good. Neutral good would fall somewhere in between. That being said, I am firmly opposed to profanity in any of our games. Personally I will not play an evil character, because I don't enjoy being evil. I also don't like hanging out with evil people. I play for enjoyment. I'm not wasting my time on a game I don't enjoy.&nbsp;

I have always thought that you portrayed Gilth as chaotic good.

Mix said: There's a difference between "allowing" and "going beyond". The Lord's Alliance would probably not pursue that goal, specifically, but that doesn't mean that they would oppose it. That being said, if the governing body were opposed to that, they might be considered lawful neutral or even lawful evil, and therefore be opposed by a lawful good character. However, a lawful good character would oppose them directly, without subterfuge, because that would not be honorable. Someone that opposed such a government with deceit and subterfuge, for the greater good would be chaotic good. Neutral good would fall somewhere in between. That being said, I am firmly opposed to profanity in any of our games. Personally I will not play an evil character, because I don't enjoy being evil. I also don't like hanging out with evil people. I play for enjoyment. I'm not wasting my time on a game I don't enjoy.&nbsp; Exactly, every good character would immediately fight against them through legal methods, subterfuge, and combat that is the issue they would have there lol.

The Order of the Gauntlet would also stand up because their goal is to protect others. Interesting concept to have guild wars.

I thought that some guilds are already opposing each other on this game? Also, Gilth&nbsp;does have a soft spot but the reason why he gets letters from the big wigs is that with enough people vouching for his character then other biased/personal lords and ladies cannot stop his goal in making the city. All of us has seen in history that there are people who goes against other based on racism and such. I know that some players have spoken about biased species and not to say much but a biased opinion on Orcs. Also if Regan can remember when rescuing&nbsp;Tiberoius from the so-called&nbsp;King, an agent from the Lord's Alliance said that this man would not be allowed to be king because the organization&nbsp;will not recognize his sovereignty. These are some things that slip through our mouth and sometimes make the characters we play have more opionions and makes them interact with different PCs and NPCs. This also helps the DMs make an interesting campaign. &nbsp;&nbsp;

The Zent's are often Neutral or evil depending on their goal at the moment. So they may be opposed by the others at times. Other then that is more like rivalries then oppistion. &nbsp;

True the Zhentarim faction are all about maintaining power to further themselves. Chaotic Neutral at best of times and evil most the time. If the Factions know what they truly are then they would work against them. They may know already. Zhentarim probably have powerful political influence and it would be difficult to take down.

When reading about that group I thought it was like you can pursue your own goal and give some of that power to the group.

No, they are a secret society of thieves and assassins who have a large influence on the dark dealings within society. Ie. black market, assassinations, subterfuge, etc....

They are skilled in that but you are referring&nbsp;to the Shadow thieves as they are also skilled related to assansinations. Have you even read all of the organization&nbsp;goals, member traits, and perks? Gilth&nbsp;takes offense against someone that does not even read all of the factions. kidding but really you can read them.&nbsp;

Many of them start out as thief or Assassins but not all. Most Zents are more Power Mongers or influence peddlers. They try and work behind the scenes and manipulate others to gain their ends. Many of them are powerful merchents or nobles. &nbsp;

Sounds like the path Gilth&nbsp;needs to take at the moment.

If you were to join the Zhentarim, you would be opposed by many good characters because of their goals. <a href="http://dnd.wizards.com/dungeons-and-dragons/story/faction/zhentarim" rel="nofollow">http://dnd.wizards.com/dungeons-and-dragons/story/faction/zhentarim</a> The Zhentarim seeks to become omnipresent and inescapable, more wealthy and powerful, and most importantly, untouchable. The public face of the organization appears much more benign, offering the best mercenaries money can buy. When a merchant needs an escort for his caravan, when a noble needs bodyguards to protect her holdings, or when a city needs trained soldiers to defend its honor, the Zhentarim provides the best-trained fighting men and women money can buy. However, the cost of doing business with the Black Network can be high. The Black Network wants to make it necessary—and preferable, even—to deal with its members. It wants to secure, over time, an iron-fisted monopoly. Members must be the best—the cheapest, the fastest, and the most secure—at providing services and goods both legal and illicit, willing to lose coin if it means destroying a competitor, and securing profits from everyone they deal with, except when to do so would work against the Black Network's ultimate goal: to make everyone dependent on it.

I have read the faction lol.

Looks like the sheets needs to be updated. Also the Lord's Alliance isn't as nice as it sounds either, yes they do combat evil but willing to have control and willing to complete a task by any means necessary sounds a little scary. One of my characters does belong to them and is willing to be a servant for them but Gilth&nbsp;knows a neighbor has more of a chance to bother his neighbor and not be smacked for it for asking something that is above his station.&nbsp;

Lawful neutral fits them the most as they have a do whatever you can to fight evil within the law look, but without the righteous justice or kindness the Order of the Gauntlet has.

Good discussion that may need to be preserved before DELETE.