[Warhammer 4e] Character Sheet (Official and Unofficial)

The Warhammer 4e thread was closed. My unofficial character sheet, a port of Axel's excellent 2e version, has been updated here&nbsp; <a href="https://github.com/vicberg/Roll20-Warhammer-4e-Character-Sheet" rel="nofollow">https://github.com/vicberg/Roll20-Warhammer-4e-Character-Sheet</a> . I have no idea where things left off with the Official Character Sheet.&nbsp; If someone has done something with it and posted to Github, feel free to post here.&nbsp;&nbsp; For my sheet, I've added two new buttons on the combat tab and added advantage into the rolls for a couple of them.&nbsp; Dodge and Cool are affected by advantage, so I've included advantage into both rolls from this page ONLY.&nbsp; There are some situations where advantage doesn't come into play, so use the Skills page to roll in those situations.&nbsp; I added the additional buttons because these are the common skills that always seem to come into play during combat and adding them to this page will make combat faster.&nbsp;

Victor B. said: I have no idea where things left off with the Official Character Sheet.&nbsp; If someone has done something with it and posted to Github, feel free to post here.&nbsp; I'm just gonna clarify that the Warhammer 4E sheet directly available on Roll20 is not an "Official", sheet. Just like 90% of the sheets on Roll20, it's unofficial and maintained by community members, not by Roll20 or the publisher. Any particular reason you created your own sheet? Roll20 tends to prefer that game systems doesn't have multiple separate community sheets(and have some base rules how they work), and thus mostly don't accept new duplicates, instead steering people to improve/contribute to the existing sheet. That being said, the Warhammer 4E sheet available on Roll20 had it's last update in August , with minor updates to translations since.

I'm using terminology incorrectly.&nbsp; By "official", I mean a Roll20 Sheet committed to Github.&nbsp; The current 4e sheet in Roll20 Github doesn't do as much as I would like, so I used Axel's 2e version and ported it to 4e.&nbsp; &nbsp;I got his permission for this as well before making it public on my own github.&nbsp; Criticals/Fumbles/Miscasts/Wrath of God charts are all built in.&nbsp; Plus Axel has some monster CSS that makes building the sheet easy. I've kept my version out of Roll20 Github for the various reasons you just stated.&nbsp; Duplicate sheets, etc..&nbsp;

Another reason why I used Axel's 2e Sheet and ported it into 4e is because it's the only sheet (I believe) for 2e.&nbsp; I was running 2e campaigns prior to going with 4e and if converting from 2e to 4e or transmogrifying to 4e, almost all of of the 2e character data comes forward into 4e.&nbsp; The current Roll20 4e sheet is entirely new.&nbsp; So I'd have to re-enter all of the data if I used the Roll20 version.&nbsp;&nbsp;

I'm interested in having a comprehensive 4e sheet, and I'm much too fond of fiddling with code that I barely understand to keep from making my own version. That was my original motivation for making my 2e sheet. Once I saw that the only published sheet for 2e at the time was much too rudimentary for my taste, I decided to publish my version. This is proof, and not the only instance, that Roll20 does sometimes allow publishing of more than one sheet for the same system, if there are good enough arguments for it. Originally, I wasn't looking to work on a 4e sheet at all, because there was a published one already, and because Victor already did the job of porting my 2e sheet to 4e. However, I know me, and I'll want my own version eventually. I'll be playing 4e soonish, and I'll be happy to share if I work on anything. Getting it published is not something I'm going to aim for this time around though, unless something is broken with the published version. It looks good to me and has some good visuals. I'll know more about how it feels once I've played with it. Oh, and I'll test yours too Victor. I like having lots of deep functionality, so I'm happy to see the critical tables easily accessible for example.

Axel &nbsp;said: Once I saw that the only published sheet for 2e at the time was much too rudimentary for my taste, I decided to publish my version. This is proof, and not the only instance, that Roll20 does sometimes allow publishing of more than one sheet for the same system, if there are good enough arguments for it Out of curiosity, when did you publish your 2e sheet? The roll20 stance on multiple sheets has changed over the years.

GiGs said: Out of curiosity, when did you publish your 2e sheet? The roll20 stance on multiple sheets has changed over the years. I published it in 2016, although it feels like it was earlier than that. I'm not certain what Roll20's stance on multiple sheets was at the time exactly, but I do remember that I had a discussion back then about there already being a sheet for 2e, before mine was accepted. I actually don't know what the policy is right now either, but I can see several systems with multiple sheets, although some are for different languages. I actually I think Havoc published theirs for Warhammer 2e in 2017. Do you know what the current stance on this is?

Axel said: GiGs said: Out of curiosity, when did you publish your 2e sheet? The roll20 stance on multiple sheets has changed over the years. I published it in 2016, although it feels like it was earlier than that. I'm not certain what Roll20's stance on multiple sheets was at the time exactly, but I do remember that I had a discussion back then about there already being a sheet for 2e, before mine was accepted. I actually don't know what the policy is right now either, but I can see several systems with multiple sheets, although some are for different languages. I actually I think Havoc published theirs for Warhammer 2e in 2017. Do you know what the current stance on this is? When character sheets were introduced, they allowed any number of sheets for each system. Then at some point (I think it was after 2016, but not sure), they switched to a hardline rule: only one community-created sheet, and one roll20-created sheet, per system. Any existing sheets were allowed to continue existing. This is why some systems do have multiple sheets. There are hints from people's discussions that they might have softened the stance, but there's been no overt declaration that I'm aware of.

GiGs said: There are hints from people's discussions that they might have softened the stance, but there's been no overt declaration that I'm aware of. There are no overt declaration on the stance having changed, but the explicit "Don't Duplicate Work" part was removed from the submission guidelines sometime in 2018. I used to link &amp; quote that segment in forum discussions ,as well as on GitHub when relevant, but to some degree think that my attempts to be helpful and point to this rule at every turn at least partially contributed to it disappearing, buuuut I'm probably overthinking it. :D In the last year or so, some of the less maintained &amp; used duplicate sheets have been removed from the drop-down selection, and a couple of older sheets have been deprecated in favour of being replaced by new sheet submissions. I think there might have been one sheet that was granted an exception for this or the issue just wasn't raised, and don't think it was a Publisher's sheet either. And with the fact that there are now three categories of character sheets on Roll20; Made by Roll20, Made by Publisher, and the community contributed, it might be much more likely that a popular sheet for a system is kept even when a Publisher-backed sheet is added. Another good point that came up with the Simple AD&amp;D 2E sheet was that complex sheet impacts game performance to a larger degree than smaller sheet, so it's possible that with a catch-all sheet that even if it has a "simple" mode and an "advanced" mode to use the sheet and customize, it doesn't make a difference for the performance as the "extra" is just hidden from view. In a large campaign, using a "smaller" sheet works much better, and at least in the examples &amp; experiences given in those discussions, made me realize that in some cases this can be fairly noticeable difference. For those curious on what the Don't Duplicate Work section used to say(when it existed): We only need one sheet for each system. For some major systems like Pathfinder or D&amp;D, we may allow more than one sheet if they are different enough, but contact us in advance before you spend a lot of time working on a new sheet for a game we already have a sheet for. We should focus on improving existing sheets, not creating totally new ones. Along those lines, this is a community effort, so if you want to help improve an existing sheet, just jump in and do so. Every time I pointed this out to duplicate submission, the person hadn't clearly ready the title, or the paragraph itself, as contacting Roll20 in advance before creating a new sheet apparently didn't occur to them. I think this "rule" was a good one as written, but removing it didn't change much as the idea is the same, having fewer but better sheets when possible.

How strict the rules about sheet submission are is at the discretion of the gate keeper. I happen to be the gate keeper as of late 2018. Several of the rules related to duplicate sheet submissions have softened. Generally we still want to avoid flooding the sheet select with low quality options later abandoned by their creators. The current goal is to keep sheet options to one-three per system of the best quality submitted by loving sheet authors who care about their creation. Here are some of my current thoughts on multiple sheets. Fewer options of higher quality is a better user experience than many options that includes low quality. Making sheets that are direct clone of another sheet is to be avoided but if a clone has all the features of the original with improvements then we can deprecate the old one so the new one can take its place. It must follow the Building Character Sheet standards. Systems can have multiple sheets as long as sheets submitted after the first include&nbsp; significant improvements in some way such as simplified version of a complex sheet, a better layout/css, or more robust options such as api support. Depending on the previous option available we may deprecate the old one to encourage people migrate to new one.&nbsp; Improving an existing sheet is typically a better option for users than creating totally new one. As programmers, sometimes what we find in the code can be a challenge to work with and you may deem it to be better to make a whole new one. Whether a duplicate will be accept to the repository is handled on a case by case.&nbsp; Cassie User Collaboration Team Lead

I'm very glad to hear an official statement on that, Cassie. I also think it sounds a very sensible, and user-friendly stance. I honestly couldnt be happier about it.

So does what Cassie said mean this sheet *might* be able to be implemented? Or do we have to update the one that's been inactive for 4months? Because the sheet in this thread looks a lot more appealing and got some great features that puts a lot less taxation on the GM.

Right now Axel is going to do something and publish it.&nbsp; Whether it's with the published version or a new version, he can answer to that.&nbsp; Mine will remain on my Github and I'll notify when I make changes.&nbsp; To implement, set your char sheet to custom, go to my github, click RAW for the HTML/CSS/JSON and copy into your custom sheet.&nbsp;&nbsp;

I do want something that works out. Though I wonder if it's possible to add a Monster sheet in as well. A simpler one without all the extra stuff.&nbsp;

I'd welcome Victor's sheet to be uploaded to the roll20 github. I'd find it difficult to update the current sheet since I don't have a game in the system and don't have the user-experience to make it more functional. Though, one of the requirements for a roll20 sheet is that the sheet should be able to function without API scripts, I'm not sure how reliant Victor's sheet is on having scripts enabled but I could see that being the primary hold up.&nbsp;

It uses built in sheet workers.&nbsp; No API

I am indeed working on a new sheet for 4e, and I'm using the general aesthetics of the current sheet as a base, changing the layout to conform more with the official paper sheet, and I was intending to implement some of the functionality that Victor has on his version, although I haven't talked to him about that yet. The idea is to have a sheet that is recognizable for those who have played 4e on Roll20 before, while still having something new, fresh, and with better functionality and a more compact and comprehensive layout. Right now, I'm actually using new attribute names, so what I'm working on would be a replacement, but I could change the attribute names if an update would be a better fit.I intend to show my work once I've got something more-or-less usable, at least with basic functionality, so that people can give feedback on if they think it's worth me publishing it. Here's a sample of what the first tab looks like right, missing some of the math. Feel free to let me know how this is shaping up so far.

For the record, i have forked and uploaded Victor's sheet to Roll20 github, last week, and have been working on a major update to it for it this week, which will go up this coming Monday. Reason i did this because while i liked Victors sheet and actually loved the original WFRP 2e sheet which he essentially ported it from. This drove me to fork victors sheet as i knew that that i could fixed it's remaining issues quickly, particularly Attributes and Spells. As time goes on i will likely diverge further and further from Victors original. My intention is to have a working, true to the rules Char Sheet for WFRP 4e which me and my friends can play long term campaigns with, so its important to us.

Justin V. said: As time goes on i will likely diverge further and further from Victors original. My intention is to have a working, true to the rules Char Sheet for WFRP 4e which me and my friends can play long term campaigns with, so its important to us. That's a pity you think it would need to diverge, considering Victor likely have the same intentions for the sheet. One issue with this will also be that now that you uploaded your modifier version of this sheet, it's less likely that the other people's work in progress would be approved separately. I'd hope people here can figure out a way to work together to have a good sheet on Roll20 together, instead of seeing it necessary to work on separate branches of almost the same sheet(code).

I disagree. I think its a good intention to try to keep it in sync, but it's not practical to expect that it will. I think it's inevitable that once the sheet goes up on github it will start to diverge. Once on github, it's open to wider community involvement and contributions, and people who might contribute won't necessarily know this thread exists.&nbsp; Victor has invited people in the past to do what Justin has done, and i think its a good thing, even if they do diverge.

How do you plan on fixing spells and what's going on with attributes that's you felt the need to do this?&nbsp;&nbsp;

Gig, I haven't had good luck with wider contributions.&nbsp; Some people just don't seem to realize that you can't change attribute names, etc.&nbsp; I've had players lose inventory, stats because of contributions.&nbsp; Someone didn't realize if you change an attribute, the original data is gone.&nbsp; I've had to go so far as to take my own copy and unsubscribe from Roll20 Github.&nbsp; But in a more perfect world, I do agree.&nbsp;&nbsp; The only thing I'm worried about now is Axel's new version.&nbsp; Will that replace the existing or be something entirely new.&nbsp; Now will be have 3 char sheets for 4e?&nbsp; Seems excessive.&nbsp; This is the exact reason I didn't publish to Roll20.&nbsp;&nbsp;

Victor, I was going to comment that I think one of the reasons you hadnt posted to github was because you want to retain control of the sheet - it is yours after all. I understand that, because I have a sheet that i havent submitted for the same reason. Once something is on github, anyone can contribute, and thats by design, and is the strength (and sometimes weakness) of the system. The roll20 staff are better at moderating changes these days. They do try to check for changing of attribute names and other sheet breaking changes, and block those submissions or require people to migrate data between the old version and new. When changes have slipped through and caused people to lose data, they've usually rolled back the sheet and undone those changes. I'd forgotten about Axel's sheet. Has that been submitted? If not, it might have missed its window, since they require submitters to justify why extra sheets for the same system should exist - the first person to submit is often the only sheet. In the olden days it was different, and sometimes extra sheets are permitted nowadays, but it isn't the norm.

No it hasn't.&nbsp; I don't know if Axel is replacing the original or planning on putting it side by side.&nbsp;&nbsp;

I was planning to show my work and ask for feedback on whether I should publish it as a new sheet or try to replace the existing one. As things stand, I may just keep mine private, the same way Victor did, because I don't want to overload the Roll20 GitHub. It's going to take me quite a while to work on it anyway, especially given the quality I'm looking for and the slow pace I can work at, so I'll wait and see what happens with this new development. I'm just thrilled to know that my original work on the 2e sheet is still relevant and that Victor found it useful for building a 4e sheet. I don't mind if my own 4e sheet is used by the community or not, once I get it to a playable state, and I'll be happy with just having a sheet for my own games, so I'll keep at it.

Actually, given the visual assets I've appropriated from the previous work, and the style I'm working with, I think it would make the most sense to replace the previous sheet. I just don't want to presume that I can do a better job than someone else.

Have you changed any attribute names?&nbsp; If you've somehow been able to maintain them, then I'd definitely say yes, but to be safe it's better sitting side by side with the original as version 2 or something like that.&nbsp; This particular sheet has had issues in the past.&nbsp; Too many contributors, each one stepping on the other and then eventually every gave up trying to update it.&nbsp;&nbsp; I'd personally like to see yours become the defacto standard for 4e and I'd like to see your version sitting side by side with the original version.&nbsp; In this light, I've made a request to Roll20 to pull my version off of Roll20 Github.&nbsp; Justin had every right to copy the code and change it for his own campaign, or fork the code and I would have been happy to merge back, but publishing code without a word to me or anyone else and then stating he's going to change it for his campaign, doesn't bode well for others who may end up using it.&nbsp; &nbsp;4e is open to broad interpretations, deliberately.&nbsp; There is no such thing as "true to the rules".&nbsp; So my guess is that the sheet will be changed for how Justin interprets the rules and have limited appeal outside of that.&nbsp;&nbsp; Also, if the driver is that it's too much of a pain to go to my github and copy 3 files from it, then that's not enough of a reason to publish my version.&nbsp; I'd prefer to keep it separate and I'll be happy to merge changes made by others back in.&nbsp;&nbsp; I also doubt Roll20 will allow 3 char sheets for the same game.&nbsp; I've already PM'd Roll20 about this.&nbsp; No clue what their stance will be.&nbsp; I've also PM'd Justin about this.&nbsp;&nbsp;

Victor B. said: I also doubt Roll20 will allow 3 char sheets for the same game.&nbsp; I've already PM'd Roll20 about this.&nbsp; No clue what their stance will be.&nbsp; I've also PM'd Justin about this.&nbsp;&nbsp; Who from Roll20 did you PM? PMing Roll20 staff might not be the most effective way, especially if you contacted someone else than Cassie (maintainer of the char sheet repo, and the right person to be in contact with).

I put a comment on the pull request. Justin seems to have uploaded it as an update, and not as a new sheet. I'm not sure that was intentional. Victor, perhaps you can tell us if that might break people's characters?

My bad, I saw an "update" pull request and made a bad assumption. Justin just posted an update to the new sheet he uploaded last week. Apparently, his upload went through as a new sheet for Warhammer Fantasy 4e.

In light of this, it might be a good idea for me to maintain attribute names to make sure I can potentially update the first 4e sheet.

No, the 4e sheet (my version) is now out there.&nbsp; The original (WFRP4CharSheet) is there also.&nbsp; I have no issues with Justin taking a copy and modify for personal use.&nbsp; I also have no issues with him placing it in his own personal github and providing a link to it in this thread.&nbsp; He's just now taken up a valuable slot in Roll20 and I don't believe he should have.&nbsp; Also I'm very concerned about his words "true to the rules" because there's really no such thing.&nbsp; I messaged Cassie, she responded.&nbsp; Hold tight Axel.&nbsp; Your's should have your version up on Roll20 and my version should be taken down.&nbsp; Let's wait for Roll20 response.&nbsp;&nbsp;

Alright, I'm still working though, so I don't have anything to upload right now. I do hope that I can get something together that will be a suitable update to the original WFRP4CharSheet.

Alright, Justin just posted his updates.&nbsp; If Roll20 doesn't choose to take it down and replace with Axels, Justin removed some of the repeating sections and replaced them with hard coded versions.&nbsp; I actually like that idea.&nbsp; I was too lazy to do it.&nbsp; However, anyone using my sheet that wants to switch over to his will need to take screen shots prior to making the switch or you'll lose data.&nbsp; Also 96-00 would be an automatic -1 SL which is in the rules, but just underneath those rules, it has a paragraph saying you don't need to play it that way if you don't like auto-success, auto-failure rules.&nbsp; You won't have a choice.&nbsp;&nbsp; So, in addition to possibly forcing Axel to update the current 4e sheet rather than posting new, changing attributes and hard coding rules into the sheet are exactly the issues I was worried about.&nbsp; For every rule in 4e, there's another saying you don't need to play it if you don't want.&nbsp; We'll see what Roll20 wants to say about this.&nbsp; If they are fine with having 3 sheets, then I have no issues with all 3 being up there, Justin's included.&nbsp; If they aren't, then we'll figure out next steps based on Roll20 response.&nbsp; What Justin is doing is actually pretty solid, but I'm a big believer that this should have been in his own Github and not published to Roll20, just like mine was and for the same reasons. But he never reached out to me before doing this, he just took the code without asking, so we are where we are at.&nbsp;&nbsp; FYI since Justin posted updates today and hasn't responded to my PM to him or this thread, I have no idea where his head is at.&nbsp; But it's more of the same, let's just post what I need to Roll20 thing that's been endemic with this char sheet for a while now.&nbsp; Hopefully Roll20 will step in and stop the madness.&nbsp;&nbsp;

This situation have really been talked about for a day, and you already some initial response from Roll20, so let's just wait a bit for those answers. I had more or less the same concerns as you, that's what my reply here from yesterday was about.

The many optional rules makes me want to limit the automation of the sheet, to allow for players to interpret results themselves.

Alright team! I have come to a conclusion and we have formulated a plan. However is its 4:43pm on a work day and I've run out to time...There is a sad doggo who wants a walk (see below). Tomorrow I'll get you an update. Have no fear as it will all come to an amicable conclusion. &lt;3

Greetings Warhammer fans, Time to weigh in on this discussion. While it may have been discourteous to submit another sheet author's work to the repository without notification, it was not in violation of any licensing agreements. Justin's submission will continue in the repository at this time and they can continue to update. We will be adding Victor's Roll20 id and/or name to that sheet for proper credit. When Axel is ready to submit their sheet it will go through the standard review process to determine if we should deprecate one of the two current Warhammer Fantasy sheets or simply add this one in addition of the two currently available. Deprecation typically is the right course when the sheet submitted's quality is equal to or better than a current one and one of the older sheets is no longer being actively developed. We use this option to maintain the number of available sheets to roughly 1 or 2 in order to reduce options bloat for users. Warhammer is a popular game and three sheets would be perfectly acceptable. It is just going to depend on the quality of code and enthusiasm of the sheet authors contributing to it. :) I appreciate everyone keeping an open and productive discussion on this. Always remember, " The sky is green. The future is green. The galaxy belongs to the orks! " -- Cassie

Thank's Cassie.&nbsp; This is a good solution.&nbsp;&nbsp;

Sounds good. I'll keep working on my project, and, although it'll be a little while yet, I'm hopeful that I'll have something that can improve on the quality of the first published sheet

All, apologies first of all I'm only just catching up with this discussion now. Really apricate everyone passion for this, clearly we all share that. And perhaps this discussion is a little over due. Victor, understand I had read a old post of yours which actively encouraged others to copy your code, so I didn't feel the need to clear it with your first. But more importantly was that you had ported Axel's excellent 2e Sheet which I really wanted to go back to for my groups 4e experience. At the same time I felt there was no official fully working 4e sheet officially available on Roll20. So I saw and took the opportunity to fill that gap. This week we fixed most of the remaining issues and did some art rework, I know its mostly borrowed assets for now, that will change. I'm more then willing to collaborate with everyone, not just on my submitted sheet of course. Next week we're preparing to implement full spell book data from the core book (editable). And build in some more automation, and start developing a template rework, still early day on that. We're really interesting in come up with new way to implement some of the new 4e mechanics, like channelling etc, I think the larger community should have input on that. Cassie I really apricate your help and patience with the updates to GitHub. And that Doggo is lovely :)

I do actively encourage.&nbsp; I wasn't clear I guess on publishing to Roll20.&nbsp; But Cassie from Roll20 is being nice and allowing 3 character sheets so all is good.&nbsp; I like your changes honestly.&nbsp; I'd suggest removing the auto -1 SL for a 96-100 roll because that's an optional rule.&nbsp; If you want others to use the sheet you need to keep it as generic as possible.&nbsp;&nbsp;

I would very much like to get some feedback on whether the automation of optional rules is a good idea? I'm still considering omitting any automation for rules that have optional variations, including qualities that influence dice rolls. There are quite a few of them, and getting all of the options to fit in the layout might be a bit difficult. For example, Victor's sheet includes options for the Defensive and Impale weapon qualities, but not Accurate. The effect of the Accurate quality might be replicated with a bonus, but it illustrates how all of the options that influence rolls might not fit on the sheet. It's going to take a bit longer to get all of the options included, but it would be ideal to have them. I just want to know how much automation is actually required to make it a good sheet?

That's a really good question.&nbsp; At one point within the repeating weapon section, I thought about adding all qualities/flaws and decided against it.&nbsp; Not enough real estate to do that.&nbsp; Enforcing rules is a tricky thing.&nbsp; Rules as written say that a talent only applied on a success.&nbsp; But if your talented in something, shouldn't that make a success easier?&nbsp; So I don't play with that rule.&nbsp;&nbsp; I added impale because that's affects the roll and possible critical and before I added it, we were missing some crits during the game.&nbsp; Defensive could be removed and added as a bonus.&nbsp; I kept it there because it was in original 2e sheet.&nbsp;&nbsp; If you really want to help game play, I don't think you need all of them.&nbsp; There's too many IMO.&nbsp; But I would suggest doing something with damaging quality (make it a checkbox because large creatures get damaging, not weapon based), possibly impact as well because that adds to damage on a successful hit bu impact only occurs on a charge, so you'd need a roll query to ask if someone is charging or not. But it;'s the interplay of your weapon to target weapon/armor that's the hard thing to manage.&nbsp; You'd need a lot of roll queries asking about the target in order to add more automation One the areas where we still miss some rules is in the area of armor qualities/flaws.&nbsp; The interplay of those two can often get forgotten during battle.&nbsp; Open helm doesn't protect on an even roll or a crit which includes both plate and mail.&nbsp; Plate/mail doesn't stop an impale weapon on a crit.&nbsp; &nbsp;That's why I added an armor qualities area so the qualities kick out on the roll and I can compare to the opponent roll.&nbsp; But we still miss those at times.&nbsp; You might kick out a message on an attack that hits the head and an even roll, "bypasses open helm and coif".&nbsp; The opponent may not have either but it's a good reminder.&nbsp; Also for a critical with an impale weapon, might add a message, "bypasses plate and mail" as a reminder.&nbsp; The only way, IMO, to truly automate a lot of this is to build an API.&nbsp; When someone rolls, the target WS is entered in a roll query as well as target armor and then the API can automate the entire thing down to the final damage, critical hits, the critical effect, etc.&nbsp; But even that gets tricky as you'd have to be explicit about the armor worn by location as it can vary.&nbsp; For example, head=none, &nbsp;body=leather and breastplate, legs=leather.&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;

Glad to see the torch is being readily picked up! After the bad blood with the current 4E sheet, I'm not particularly concerned with these new upstarts deprecating what we have as long as the attributes are matched to conserve player's data.&nbsp; Though, seeing the "Roll" button labeled as "Roll" is killing me. I know the numerical-total label was breaking in firefox but there is a fix that would let you replace the "Roll" text with the calculated total, which I think would look much nicer.&nbsp;

Well, styling the buttons is a matter of aesthetic opinion, and I usually prefer having them either show relevant text or dice. For example, the pictos font is useful for buttons. As for showing the relevant number to roll against is also a good idea, and I would want to see an example of how to do that. Also, maintaining player data may not be possible with a new sheet, although an effort can be made.

Axel said: Also, maintaining player data may not be possible with a new sheet, although an effort can be made. Maintaining player data is always possible. Thats what versioning sheet workers are for.

GiGs said: Maintaining player data is always possible. Thats what versioning sheet workers are for. That's encouraging, but I'm a mere novice when it comes to sheet workers. It would be useful to have a sheet worker that transferred the attributes from an old version as a one-time deal, but I have no idea where to start on that.

Axel said: GiGs said: Maintaining player data is always possible. Thats what versioning sheet workers are for. That's encouraging, but I'm a mere novice when it comes to sheet workers. It would be useful to have a sheet worker that transferred the attributes from an old version as a one-time deal, but I have no idea where to start on that. The basic technique as as followers: You create an attribute on your sheet, name it something like version, and give it a default value of 0. Each time you make changes that need data migration, you give the sheet a new version number - but you dont change that attribute in the html, you do it through a versioning sheet worker. It works like this: The versioning sheet worker runs on&nbsp; sheet:opened , so it runs every time a player opens the sheet. The first thing it does, is check the value of the version attribute. If the sheet is up to date (has the correct version number), it exits and does nothing. If the version is less than the current number, the worker continues and migrates the data, and then changes the version to the new number. The next time the sheet is opened, the version number will be up to date, and so the sheet worker does nothing. By this method you have a sheet worker that only does its version changes once, and does it automatically when a sheet is opened. So sheets that need updating automatically update themselves.

Axel said: Well, styling the buttons is a matter of aesthetic opinion, and I usually prefer having them either show relevant text or dice. For example, the pictos font is useful for buttons. As for showing the relevant number to roll against is also a good idea, and I would want to see an example of how to do that. Also, maintaining player data may not be possible with a new sheet, although an effort can be made. Well, you might be able to do it at the same time as figuring out sheetworkers to migrate attributes. The current "bug" is that you can't use auto-calculated fields inside of buttons. The current work-around is to do the math in sheet-workers and displaying the results in labels on the buttons.&nbsp;

Thank you, that's a helpful explanation, but sadly not enough for me to actually write the code myself. Is something like this what I'm looking for? <a href="https://app.roll20.net/forum/post/5798542/help-explain-this-working-sheet-worker-to-me/?pageforid=5798542#post-5798542" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/forum/post/5798542/help-explain-this-working-sheet-worker-to-me/?pageforid=5798542#post-5798542</a>