Katie Mae said: Hi folks! Sneaking over here during a meeting to announce that the new Dim Lighting improvements are live on the Dev server. It includes two bug fixes, but more importantly, there's a slider now. Let us know what you think! I think the point was missed. The Problem UDL's low light gradient starts much brighter and fades to black. This is magnified much more strongly over the long distance that dim lights have to project to act as dim ambient lighting. LDL's dim light starts dimmer and has a more subtle gradient before fading to black near the end. Looking at the following reference photo, light 1 is 300 feet of low light, and lights 2 and 3 are 25 feet of low light. Walls have been added to show the difference between the low light of 1 when it is near to the source and when it is farther from the source. The viewer of 1-2 is about 55 feet from light 1, and the viewer of 1-3 is about 110 feet from light 1. Light 1 is the same light source in both pictures. Lights 2 and 3 are the same intensity to each other, but compared to 1, there is a massive difference in 1's intensity nearer to its source (when compared to 2) and farther from its source (when compared to 3). 1-3 is a "good" comparison, but 1 is much too bright when compared to 3. Slider pushes the problem further away Adjusting the brightness of the dim light does not solve the issue. Low light being too intense can be an issue anywhere because of the brightness at the core and how fast it drops off, but it is at its most noticeable when used long distances for ambient light (as above). Sliding the brightness slider all the way down on light 1 does get it to be slightly darker than light 2, but it is then much darker than light 3. I personally don't think the slider solves the problem at hand and introduces a level of complexity to a portion of UDL that is not really needed until the basic functionality of UDL is bulletproof. My take is that, while it could have some interesting applications down the line, it is mostly a toy and needs some more thinking through. LDL does ambient light fairly well It is not possible to have an ambient light be mostly consistent over 100 feet in UDL. In comparison, LDL does also start brighter and fade over distance, but that gradient is much more subtle. 1-2 and 1-3 are much closer to each other. 1 is slightly brighter than 2 and slightly dimmer than 3, but 1 provides a much more consistent light over the distance. Reference issues Two posts that I can remember UDL low light being brought up as significantly too bright are when it is dealing with a single low light being broadcast over a large area to work as dim ambient light. <a href="https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/9687717/" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/9687717/</a> - Marko L.'s example <a href="https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/9743148/" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/forum/permalink/9743148/</a> - My example (explained above in more detail) The slider doesn't help this. Either the low light is too bright close to the light source, or the low light is too dim far from the light source. It is unable to be "just right" in both locations. Other solutions Multiple low lights While available now, it unfortunately doesn't work well to use two dim lights to simulate ambient light, because they mix strangely at the border. This is not as much of an issue for multiple small lights near each other, but a smooth area without light interaction is wanted when simulating dim lighting conditions over a large area. Either the lights do not interact, leaving gaps, or they interact and cause bands of brighter areas where the illumination should be consistent. Match LDL The most straightforward solution might just be to have the gradient match the change in intensity that LDL currently has. UDL's primary advantage with low light over LDL is that there is no "bright core" at the middle of the dim light, but LDL's dim light is easier to use because it is more consistent in intensity over distance. Adjustable global illumination Having the slider instead change the brightness of daylight mode while allowing other lights to still operate would obviate the use case for simulating ambient light with one or more low lights casting light over a long distance. If we could have dim light over an entire map and add additional lights to make brighter light, that covers a lot of use cases. The downside is that it doesn't let you have an interior location be dark (because it's global illumination). Lightmaps Possibly the best solution, and something that would likely have to be implemented down the road, would be light maps. Allowing a user to define an area on the DL layer (whether by dropping a white rectangular JPG, drawing a closed polygon, or some other means) would allow the user to say, "This area should be lit with this color and intensity of light." It would allow exterior areas of a map to be lit while leaving the interior dark. Having that defined area be seen as a third kind of light would allow it to be turned on and off, moved, and otherwise manipulated and interact well with the other types of light. Unfortunately, my guess is that this would be difficult with the current implementation of UDL lights since it seems some kind of ring is used as a mask to create the fade to black at the end of the light's radius (inferred because of how lights will draw dark rings when they intersect other lights). If each light source just faded, they could be composited (along with the user editable lightmaps) into an overall lightmap for the page. (But if wishes were horses. . . ) And the crashes Additionally, UDL "crashed" 3 different times during testing. This mostly occurred while switching between LDL and UDL or leaving the tab and coming back. The VTT went black, and when I selected the token and clicked Ctrl+L, it would show the entire contents of the VTT instead of just what that token could see. I had to refresh the browser tab to reset things.