Gold said: Brian & Falk -- Re: Map Layer Streetlights, chandaliers, campfires, torches, The Eye Of Sauron, the fires of hell, are not on the GM Layer and shouldn't be forced to place on the Token Layer. They should be able to be placed on the MAP LAYER just like the buildings, trees, roads, and ground. Players not having control of those tokens won't save the DM from Selecting all of the Streetlamps and mistakenly moving them, when you're just trying to select the battle participants on the token layer. Also the GM would be forced to select every single Fire / Chandalier / Lamp and set it to "Is Drawing" mode, one by one, if not you'll have Streetlamp poles with Hit Point bubbles showing. (Token Bubbles & Bars conveniently are automatically hidden if the graphic object is on the Map Layer). Also all of the Fires & Chandaliers would fall victim to the Z-Order of the Token Layer, whereas Map layer is always behind Tokens. There are many valid reasons to want Map Layer objects to be able to emit light. Brian C. said: Falk said: But you can always create token that are not in player control, why would you need to put those on the map layer? That's a good point. That swarm of goblins would generally be on the GM Layer or Token Layer rather than the Map Layer. Naw, guys. Think more broadly about accommodating different users. We're not all placing Goblins as the light source. I think I am being misunderstood. My understanding is that Keith was saying that night vision should be limited in some way when the token is on the map layer. One of the examples was that a mob of goblins with night vision blocked out any ability to see the lighting in the area. My understanding of what Falk was saying was that those NPCs would not normally be on the map layer, to which I agreed. My take is that even if NPCs were to have vision/night vision for some reason, they would be on the GM layer or token layer, and we don't need to restrict night vision on the Map layer because it normally would not come into play in that scenario. I think we are in agreement, Gold. My take is that tokens should have their full light/vision/night vision capabilities on both the Map and Token layers because that yields the most flexibility in setting up a scene, although I am happy to hear from an alternate point of view.