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[5e Macro] Rerolling, but only once

1406432178

Edited 1406861242
D&D 5e recently introduced re-rolling 1s and 2s, but only one time. If you get a 1 or a 2 on the re-roll, you take that re-roll. So for example a 2d6 that comes up as a 1 and a 4 would re-roll the 1, but if it comes up another 1 you take that. The current re-roll option for Roll20, which would be phrased as /roll 2d6r<2, re-rolls all 1s and 2s, even the ones that come up on the re-roll. So that doesn't work for the 5e rule. Anyone know if there is a way to do this? Seems like it's going to be needed a whole lot, coming up here pretty quick (as it is a rule in the Starter set and the Basic rules, which are both already out now). Thanks for your help. -Mistwell
[[ ({ 1d1, 1d6 }kh1) + ({ 1d1, 1d6 }kh1) ]]
Mark, I don't follow your logic. If I rolled a 1 on the d6 in your example I wouldn't have a reroll mechanic, I'd just be stuck with the one because both dice are ones. Or what am I missing? I mean I see how your roll would keep anything over a one, but just not catching the re-roll.
Look a the construct as a single "roll" condition in real life. 1d1 represents you having "rolled" a 1 in real life. If you don't "roll" a 1, nothing happens and it produces a regular 1d6 as your normal roll. If you do "roll" a 1 (represented by 1d1), you then roll a 1d6 and if you still get a 1, it produces a 1 Statistically, no, it's technically not the same as rolling two dice. To do that you need an API script to roll a 1d6, check if it's a one, and re-roll another 1d6. If it's troublesome, you can always just put two rolls next to each other in your macros and use the second roll or ignore it as needed. /me rolls and tries to get lucky [[1d6]]/[[1d6]] (Use second roll if it's a 1) Or just roll your macro again like you'd roll again in real life.
Good catch, I think I'll house rule GWF for roll20 usage to make it easier. Instead of 1 reroll on 1s and 2s, you just get infinite rerolls on 1s. I think that should be close enough to fair. Slightly weaker, but you can never get a 1. With all of the calculations that have to go into macros to be fire and forget it makes it far too time consuming to try to do every rule 100% correct. Their intention is to save time and keep play moving.
1406659303
Lithl
Pro
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Hmm... on a d6, rerolling a 1 or 2 once, your chances of a 1 or 2 are 5.55% (1/18) and your chances of any other number are 22.22% (4/18). A nice non-API solution might be to use a rollable table with weights 1,1,4,4,4,4. If you wanted images in /roll you'd have to upload them, but that gets you the same math as an actual one-time reroll.
1406675667
Paul S.
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Or ... your players can just have a button that rolls /r ?{Number of dice?|1}d{Die Type?|6} Then if they need to reroll for whatever reason - they can just hit the button again. Seems pretty easy hitting a button twice.... You could build a macro for each die type and not have to even bother with the modifiers.
Thanks guys I will see if I can work through some of these suggestions (seems like the more accurate ones are pretty lengthy). Many feats and class abilities apparently require re-rolls but taking the result of the re-roll as well. And as it appears to be the #1 talked about game on the internet , by a wide margin, it sure seems like a more official re-roll mechanic should be included rather than kloogey ones to work around the issue? Maybe something like /roll 2d6rr<2 would re-roll, but take the results of the re-roll instead of continuing to re-roll the results of the first re-roll if they also come up 1 or 2?
Honestly, I'm just going to let it slide on the multiple rerolls and I imagine other DMs would too.
How about this. /roll {(d4+2)*(ceil((d9-1)/9)),d2}kh1 You've got a 1 in 9 chance (one-third times one-third) of rolling below a 3 twice. In that case it's a d2. Otherwise, you've got equal chances of a 3 through 6, otherwise known as a d4+2.
1406861110

Edited 1406861516
Bryan K. said: Honestly, I'm just going to let it slide on the multiple rerolls and I imagine other DMs would too. For years? We want people going around saying "Sure, you could use Roll20 to play D&D, but it doesn't really support all the standard things you can do in the PHB, like a normal re-roll"? Seems like one of those "cheap to fix, expensive not to" type situations, from a public relations perspective. Also, seems like a more major issue to me than that. In my 2d6 example, 1/3 of all the re-rolls would be inaccurate (1/3 of all re-rolls of a d6 are a 1 or 2). For example, I just did /roll 2d6r<2 and got three re-rolls on the first die and one re-roll on the second die, until it finally had no 1s or 2s counting. It's something that is likely to come up almost every combat, and people are just going to hand-waive the difference between a creature dropping or not, for years, just because?
1406915571
Paul S.
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Roll20 does indeed support everything needed for D&D. A normal re-roll. Let's think about this for a second. In real life what is required. Rolling a die, observing the result, either rerolling or not rerolling, if rerolled - keep the required value. Roll20 emulates this perfectly. You hit a button to roll a die. You observe the result. You either hit the button again to reroll or you don't. If you rerolled, you keep the required value. I don't see how hitting a button twice is overly burdensome on players or GMs.
1406920110

Edited 1406920146
Let's head off and disagreements of opinions... Mechanically, we have a few interesting recommendations and options for handling a reroll in this thread. For any recommendations for new features in the future, I would recommend you post something in the 'Suggestions & Ideas" forums. The Specific Use forum really isn't for that and won't add anything appreciable to the discussion.
Mark G. raises good points. I'm sure the Dev Team is already aware of this, after reading the 5E basic rules the day they became available (like all us cool kids did). My awesome solution above, and all the others, are just stopgaps for the short term. I expect we'll be using a nifty new syntax for this dice mechanic before you can say "I just bought the new Monster Manual."
1406942525

Edited 1406942747
Paul S. said: Roll20 does indeed support everything needed for D&D. A normal re-roll. Let's think about this for a second. In real life what is required. Rolling a die, observing the result, either rerolling or not rerolling, if rerolled - keep the required value. Roll20 emulates this perfectly. You hit a button to roll a die. You observe the result. You either hit the button again to reroll or you don't. If you rerolled, you keep the required value. I don't see how hitting a button twice is overly burdensome on players or GMs. It isn't except when you don't use complicated macros.
DM Mark said: Bryan K. said: Honestly, I'm just going to let it slide on the multiple rerolls and I imagine other DMs would too. For years? We want people going around saying "Sure, you could use Roll20 to play D&D, but it doesn't really support all the standard things you can do in the PHB, like a normal re-roll"? Seems like one of those "cheap to fix, expensive not to" type situations, from a public relations perspective. Also, seems like a more major issue to me than that. In my 2d6 example, 1/3 of all the re-rolls would be inaccurate (1/3 of all re-rolls of a d6 are a 1 or 2). For example, I just did /roll 2d6r<2 and got three re-rolls on the first die and one re-roll on the second die, until it finally had no 1s or 2s counting. It's something that is likely to come up almost every combat, and people are just going to hand-waive the difference between a creature dropping or not, for years, just because? To echo what the other poster said Roll20 has always been about preserving the tabletop experience. Automation has crept in based on user demand but Roll20 will never be comprehensive. If you were at a table and rolled a die that then required a reroll, the die wouldn't magically reroll itself. If you've issues with the amount of rerolls required for this particular mechanic you should take it up with WotC.
This is one of those situations that requires DM's discretion. As a DM, I do not allow rerolling of any die (unless it rolled off the table) if you limp wristed it and it rolled a 1, sorry charlie. DM's discretion is my favorite part of the rules.
1407038487
Lithl
Pro
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Um, what? This is talking about an actual game mechanic which instructs you to reroll.
Just a quick idea /r ceil(2d6/2) should get you the same mechanic. It only gives you a 1 or 2 if both dice are rolled 1 or 2. If both 1s you get 2/2=1 if 1 and 2 you get 3/2=1.5=2 granted you are going to get 3 more often than if you roll a standard d6. But this whole mechanic is weighted toward rolling 3s. Just an idea I had. I am fixing to start a 5e campaign and this is the solution I came up with, so I thought I'd share. (I use anydice.com to see the statitistics about any give combo of rolls and this one most closely mimiced what I wanted.)
1407109855
Lithl
Pro
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Fear the Alpaca said: Just a quick idea /r ceil(2d6/2) should get you the same mechanic. It only gives you a 1 or 2 if both dice are rolled 1 or 2. If both 1s you get 2/2=1 if 1 and 2 you get 3/2=1.5=2 granted you are going to get 3 more often than if you roll a standard d6. But this whole mechanic is weighted toward rolling 3s. Just an idea I had. The distribution of d6, reroll once on 1,2 is: 2/36 2/36 8/36 8/36 8/36 8/36 The distribution of 2d6/2, round up is: 1/36 5/36 9/36 11/36 7/36 3/36 That's not anywhere near correct. You're getting half the correct number of 1s, less than half the correct number of 6s, more than double the correct number of 2s, an overabundance of 3s and 4s, and a dearth of 5s. 3 and 5 are the closest to correct, but with such small numbers, it's still a noticeable difference. I think the best solution with our current tools is to create a rollable table with appropriate weights (1,1,4,4,4,4). You'll get exactly the correct die results. You won't get 3D dice, but don't d6s have issues with the 3D anyway?
notBowen said: DM Mark said: Bryan K. said: Honestly, I'm just going to let it slide on the multiple rerolls and I imagine other DMs would too. For years? We want people going around saying "Sure, you could use Roll20 to play D&D, but it doesn't really support all the standard things you can do in the PHB, like a normal re-roll"? Seems like one of those "cheap to fix, expensive not to" type situations, from a public relations perspective. Also, seems like a more major issue to me than that. In my 2d6 example, 1/3 of all the re-rolls would be inaccurate (1/3 of all re-rolls of a d6 are a 1 or 2). For example, I just did /roll 2d6r<2 and got three re-rolls on the first die and one re-roll on the second die, until it finally had no 1s or 2s counting. It's something that is likely to come up almost every combat, and people are just going to hand-waive the difference between a creature dropping or not, for years, just because? To echo what the other poster said Roll20 has always been about preserving the tabletop experience. Automation has crept in based on user demand but Roll20 will never be comprehensive. If you were at a table and rolled a die that then required a reroll, the die wouldn't magically reroll itself. If you've issues with the amount of rerolls required for this particular mechanic you should take it up with WotC. Roll20 already supports a certain re-roll mechanic with a special built-in command. However, it only supports it for the 4e mechanic, not the 5e mechanic. All I am asking is that it support it for the 5e mechanic. That's not WOTC's fault - they just put out an edition that Roll20 wants to support. But Roll20 already committed to the idea it would support re-rolls with an automatic (or "magically reroll" if you prefer) command, and I am just saying then there should be one for the current edition of D&D too. I don't think that is asking for a lot. I also don't think it's asking for it to be comprehensive when I am asking for it to support a very common thing, in a very common game, concerning a topic Roll20 has already supported for a different version of that same game.
Michael P. said: This is one of those situations that requires DM's discretion. As a DM, I do not allow rerolling of any die (unless it rolled off the table) if you limp wristed it and it rolled a 1, sorry charlie. DM's discretion is my favorite part of the rules. It's an in-game rule that requires a re-roll, but only one re-roll. You can certainly house-rule it out, but I am not sure what your response has to do with the topic.
Brian said: Hmm... on a d6, rerolling a 1 or 2 once, your chances of a 1 or 2 are 5.55% (1/18) and your chances of any other number are 22.22% (4/18). A nice non-API solution might be to use a rollable table with weights 1,1,4,4,4,4. If you wanted images in /roll you'd have to upload them, but that gets you the same math as an actual one-time reroll. I'd have to do this for every single die-type that comes up in the game that gets a re-roll.
1407993108
Lithl
Pro
Sheet Author
API Scripter
There are exactly 6 die types in D&D. At worst, you're looking at 6 rollable tables.
just curious, if one did create tables for each die (dice?) how would you call them in a macro etc same as normal "/roll 3t[d6]" or the like?
1408002897
Lithl
Pro
Sheet Author
API Scripter
Yeah, where "d6" is whatever you name the table. I'd probably name it something to make clear the table is doing the reroll-once action, though.