[5e Shaped] v2.1.3 NPCs

That sneak attack damage and Divine Smite is awesome!!!  Had pre-game session with my players last night, and was trying to figure out with our rogue how we were going to do it.  Now you created the perfect thing for it!!!  Love that you have to select to roll it or not, which is great...will it automatically roll double the dice if the attack is a crit?

It cannot roll double the dice if it is a crit as it's a separate roll template. I previously considered adding another field (Extra damage) that could be added on, but that would then have to run a query to use it or not before the whole thing resolves. Kevin stumbled upon this way of doing it after I made the buttons and I think it works quite well. For a crit in this situation you can just click the "Sneak Attack" wording twice. Works pretty well. Better than the other concept imo.

that is actually great, thanks for the tip.  Again great work on the sheet.  Each addition just makes it better and better.

Maybe I wasn't clear on the passive perception (or maybe I was clear and you just disagree with me. :) ). Let me restate and make sure we're on the same page. I'm not asking you add a passive perception field. I'm just asking that the npc sheet not be missing information from the basic monster manual monster stat block. In the monster manual stat block, passive perception is listed on the "senses" line. It's in the SRD entry as it's own field. While I agree with you that passive perception doesn't need to be on the PC sheet, it's VERY useful for monsters. :) PCs sneak all the time. Monsters rarely do. I've been adding it manually to senses for the monsters I've entered, but it would be great if the drag and drop would add it to the senses field after darkvision in the light. Is that clearer, or did you understand me the first time and just think that your way is better? (I don't mind if you disagree with me. It's not THAT much work for me to add it on every monster.) BTW, your saving throw feature finally broke me on letting the PCs see my monster rolls. Having them be able to click on that save then their token is just too nice a feature for me to deny it to them. :)

@Kryx: Curious where the conversion script status is in the mix? Any idea when that might be implemented? Thanks, John

I'm guessing we need to stop barraging him with bug reports and enhancement requests first. I'm a Patreon backer of this sheet, now! You all should be too. (I'm thinking of sending him a paypal payment too, just to contribute for the massive amount of startup work this was.)

@Robert: Passive Perception : I'm not sure entirely how to feel here. Likely I'll have to do it because people keep asking. :P  I can make it visually a part of senses for NPCs, that'd be no problem. Though it needs to be a number so it can be referenced for macros that people make (won't be a problem). I'll add this to my TODO. On showing info : You can hide certain parts with the hide settings on the settings page and setting up the stylish CSS. I'm glad that you like that feature though. :) @John K: Conversion scripts are in line after import scripts which are in line after finalizing touches on the sheet. I only have so much bandwidth to work on this sheet (the amount of hours spent on it are already very high). Additional features will come. @Robert: Thanks for contributing and suggesting others do as well. I would be willing to prioritize features or fixes for people who do contribute.

Hey Kryx, Just came back to this after a while away - have been sucked down an API script rabbit hole in the form of a  Dynamic Lighting template script for the past week! The sheet is looking completely amazing - thanks so much for all your work. I've just gone to try out some of the new features and I've run into a problem on one of my character sheets - created afresh for the shaped sheet maybe 2 weeks ago - whenever I try to click "add" on the spells repeating section it does nothing at all. I get a "CLICKED" log in the JS console, but no new rows. Works fine on a new sheet. Was wondering if there was a way that I could fix this without having to re-enter the whole sheet from scratch again :-( Cheers, Lucian

@Lucian: Sounds like you have some filtering on your spells. Check all the buttons right above spells that they are set to the most wide-reaching settings.

D'oh. Yep, that was it. It's a shame that there isn't an easy way to turn off the filters when you click the add button to save you answering that question every time a muppet like me does this :-) Lucian

No worries, I'm sure it won't be the last time I have to answer it. :P Nothing can be triggered on "Add" unfortunately. :(

Just ran last Saturday with this sheet and the Token Action Script. So far it went absolutely smoothly with almost no hiccups. We currently have no need to ask for more right now.  Their shall be a Mind Flayer by the name of Kryx soon, that is for sure.  I will give whatever feedback I can really. As for the constant asks of Passive Perceptions. Honestly? Passive Perception is an odd rule in of it self. It heavily depends on the DM to decide when and where it plays into action. I do agree that having a senses section include the PP would be nice though. I use it quite often to hand-wave alot of rolling if I can. For example if the group roll stealth checks, its vs the PP of NPC. If NPC is stealthing against PCs, they Stealth check vs PP. The other party may actively roll against the other if searching for them. I do the same thing for traps, enviromental hazards etc as well. This way I can just roll for things against their PP without having to inform the PCs of whats happened. This way it avoids the paranoid inch check per 5 ft nonsense xD

Just tried out version -.11 Love the text size on the Saving Throw Roll Template. Now yer talkin'. Still have a problem with deleting an attacher; Steps to reproduce; Create new character Drag dagger (or any weapon) from Compendium Click Add in attacher section, give name (whatever) with text (whatever) and check Attack box Click on dagger attack to see output with attacher info at bottom Go back to attachers, click modify Click on trash can, attacher disappears Click done Repeat step 4. Also, found when dragging Saving Throws button to macro bar , it is called saving_throw_macro but when clicked, rolls Ability Chec k macro. But when clicking from the sheet, rolls properly. Ability Checks rolls properly from the sheet and when dragged to the macro bar, but the name is saving_throw_macro so that might be a clue.

This isn't a bug per se, but I thought I'd throw it out there in case anyone has a fix. I use the group initiative API. With the community contributed sheet, if I rolled initiative and the token already had an initiative in the order, it just did nothing. With this sheet it closes the initiative tracker. Just a little annoying. Anyone have a guess why? I liked being able to select everyone on the field and hitting the macro instead of having to choose my targets. :)

Concentration spells no longer show that they are Concentration spells in the Roll template. It'd be useful if they did.

Kyrx, Trying to reference a reaction in npc character sheet and I thought it would be %{name|repeating_reaction_$0_reaction} but that does not seem to be working for me.  Is there another naming convention for the reactions?

@Doug: I'll look into that issue. Thanks for a full reproduction path. @Robert: I'll send Aaron a PM. Perhaps he knows. @Thorsten: concentration is expected to appear within duration like it is in the book. Perhaps I should hide the checkbox which is there for filtering purposes. @Michael: it's  %{name|repeating_reaction_$0_action} All of those areas share the same code.

Small issue - Divine smite query error with 4+: Query is putting 4++1 in for the number of d8 as 4+ is not a label in that query but the value. As for the grey text, I will say one last thing on it. While we disagree on making it a roll option, having/not having grey text is a change in the roll even if it is just display. The issue remains, at least for me, that I would like to have "2 rolls without grey text" and that is a feature the sheet lacks. I think it should be a roll option like the community contributed sheet (especially if roll option for each roll is done like the community sheet as I would want grey text on some not others which a global option may not work with). This is one of those small things that I would really like which is why I have mentioned it so much here but will stop here.

Fixed Paladin Divine smite. It'll be on the next release. To clarify roll options: You want "Roll with Advantage, but without looking like Advantage". I understand you really want it, but still do not see the use case for how this is different from Advantage or why it should be offered. Kevin's new script gives a nice way to change between Advantage/Diadvantage/Normal. I'll probably encourage my players to use it.

I'm curious why people want double rolls without the grey text. Is there a reason to roll two with advantage/disadvantage?

@Kaelev I'm curious why people want double rolls without the grey text. Is there a reason to roll two with advantage/disadvantage? The reason for my group is it is just a small visual thing. The grey text allows the higher/lower number to stand out more. My group always rolls 2 rolls but we are not always advantaged/disadvantaged meaning we want to use the first number only most of the time and don't want grey text making it less visible at a glance. In the few cases however the advantage/disadvantage comes up we can just look at the higher/lower of the two number without issue. Using query for roll type here is pointless as it slows the game down and is a extra click needed for little use which is not good when 90% of the time is a normal roll and changing to advantage/disadvantage rolls sheet wide for one roll made on the spot is is a waste of time. So in short, the reason is we want two rolls but not have the first number (that we use the most) be less visible as query roll type is inefficient.

Got to say, personally would rather Kryx not worry about such a small cosmetic thing, and no offence @Vanakoji, you are the only person that this seems to bother.  I get why it is there, and am pretty sure I can handle ignoring the grey number, cause my eye just goes to the first number rolled, the one on the left...grey or not.  The daily additions to this sheet are amazing and would rather see those great new features keep coming than getting bogged down in again small cosmetic things.

Are we still waiting on Roll20 to push the updated 5E sheet?  Also, if I go and update the sheet myself (as a mentor), will I need to manually go and get all future updates to the sheet?  (I'm trying to decide whether to keep waiting or not! :)) Excited for the new sheet; thanks for all your work.

Not that its a huge deal for me, but my group does things the same way as @Vanakoji. so there are more groups that do it that way.  My group has not been able to play since the new sheet so I do not know how much of an issue it will end up being.  

I am trying to type up some tables in google docs on how to reference anything on the sheet as I have time here and there to help with the wiki later and have noticed 2 small things so far. Hp and Speed cannot have the macro as if clicked referenced properly. Using %{NAME|hp} gives a syntax error (as if a number was left blank) whole %{NAME|speed} outputs the macro as if there is no speed value so the roll appears, but you just get the title as if there is no value.

Michael M. said: Are we still waiting on Roll20 to push the updated 5E sheet?  Also, if I go and update the sheet myself (as a mentor), will I need to manually go and get all future updates to the sheet?  (I'm trying to decide whether to keep waiting or not! :)) Excited for the new sheet; thanks for all your work. Yes, still waiting on Roll20. This response time is pretty normal. It often takes a week or more for them to make my sheet live. And yes, if you manually update you have to continuously manually update (or you can swap over to the roll20 one when they do it). @Ken So your group also uses Roll with Advantage (Previously known as Roll 2). That option functions the same for crits and is still available. What Vanakoji wants is a a styling change.

2.1.12 Fixed Paladin Divine Smite to work with "4+" Fixed HP and Speed for PC by renaming them for NPC: "npc_hp", "npc_speed".

In almost all the 5e games I've played that use some kind of macro or powercard or roll template, they roll twice and just use the first roll if adv/dis isn't there.

Vanakoji said: Small issue - Divine smite query error with 4+: Query is putting 4++1 in for the number of d8 as 4+ is not a label in that query but the value. As for the grey text, I will say one last thing on it. While we disagree on making it a roll option, having/not having grey text is a change in the roll even if it is just display. The issue remains, at least for me, that I would like to have "2 rolls without grey text" and that is a feature the sheet lacks. I think it should be a roll option like the community contributed sheet (especially if roll option for each roll is done like the community sheet as I would want grey text on some not others which a global option may not work with). This is one of those small things that I would really like which is why I have mentioned it so much here but will stop here. Honestly greyed out text is most likely an easy fix at some point. Probably involving removing a html # color code. It might be worth taking a look for it yourself. Id help you But im at work currently.

That is exactly what Rolling with Advantage does. Again, it is the same behavior.

Kryx said: That is exactly what Rolling with Advantage does. Again, it is the same behavior. Mechanically, yes... it is the same behavior, but visually it is not. Roll 2 without adv/dis should show both rolls in black. Otherwise, one of them is getting greyed out and that is a visual problem. 

Both this sheet and the OGL sheet have altered crits to only show in certain conditions. See above: Roll 2 rolls with Advantage: Roll 1 or roll 2 is a crit - show crit damage Roll 1 is a crit - show crit damage Roll 2 is a crit - show crit damage Roll 2 rolls with Disadvantage: Roll 1 and Roll20 are both crits - show crit damage Roll 1 is a crit - no crit Roll 2 is a crit - no crit "Rolling 2" has the exact same fucntionality as advantage and therefore should visually show that to the user.

Except a lot of people simply want to roll two rolls without advantage or disadvantage and without either number being greyed out . That way if something comes up after the roll is made and they would have had advantage or disadvantage, they still have the second number there just in case and the first number isn't greyed out if it was lower.

Please explain to me in the decision tree format presented above how "Roll 2" works differently than "Roll 2 rolls with Advantage".

Kryx said: @Ken So your group also uses Roll with Advantage (Previously known as Roll 2). That option functions the same for crits and is still available. What Vanakoji wants is a a styling change. I know, what I'm saying is that my group has a similar issue,  we roll 2 all the time, most of the time we only consider the 1st roll.  so with the styling change, the first roll will often be greyed out - even though that is the roll we want to look at.  Using the query every time will slow the game down (I think anyway) So what I was saying is that Vanakoji is not the only one who would benefit from having the lowest number greyed out (which looks cool by the way) be optional.  I understand if you do not want to do the work, you have done a great job with the sheet and I know that effort may be better spent somewhere else.  It just look like the discussion on the forums was sounding like Vanakoji was alone and that is not the case.

Kryx said: Please explain to me in the decision tree format presented above how "Roll 2" works differently than "Roll 2 rolls with Advantage". Roll 2 would not grey out either number. That's it. That's what I want. That's what others want. We don't want the first number to be greyed out if it happens to be lower than the second number.

I have to say I agree with the difficult minority(?) about the greying out behaviour. It's not a huge issue, but it does make me pause for a fraction of a second each time I look at a result. I think that possibly the miscommunication here is that this not purely about the critical behaviour - it's about the roll results themselves. When you roll 2 with advantage, the lower roll is greyed out and the higher one is black. Your eye is drawn to the black number, as it should be, because that's the relevant one (you have advantage). But numerous people (myself included) don't like the idea of having to configure ahead of time whether a roll is with (dis)advantage or not. It's fiddly, and there are lots of circumstantial reasons why (dis)advantage might or not apply. We want to see two rolls in case it is necessary, but the vast majority of the time, the only roll that will be relevant is the first one (because neither advantage nor disadvantage apply). In this majority case, the current behaviour is visually confusing 50% of the time, because the first number (being lower) is greyed out, even though this is the relevant number in the situation.  Lucian

But wont removing the grey numbers mean there's no reason to have Adv/Disadv in the roll query? It'd just be roll normal and roll two? My group all agrees that rolling two can be disappointing as sometimes you end up with a really nice crit on the second roll, but they do not have advantage on the roll. So they'd much rather not see those crits go by. They rather make the conscious decision to roll with Adv/Disadv. 

HoneyBadger said: Roll 2 would not grey out either number. That's it. That's what I want. That's what others want. We don't want the first number to be greyed out if it happens to be lower than the second number. I'm not asking about styling choices. I'm asking about the mechanics of the decision tree. Please stop being so hostile. I do this in my free time for fun, not necessarily to please your every whim - please keep that in mind and be respectful. @Ken: I agree that Vanakoji is not the only person. I did not make that claim, someone else did. :) Whenever something is designed/changed a certain percentage of the users will inherently dislike the design/change. The point I'm trying to get across is that the design is there for a reason - to bring to light the same functionality and to highlight the more important roll. Instead of initially saying a change is bad a user should try out that new way. Maybe it isn't good, maybe it is. Generally this is how Software design and Design in general work. I think it's important to note that the OGL does not provide the option sought after either. They offer "Always Roll Advantage", "Advantage Toggle", "Query Advantage", or "Never roll Advantage". Those options mirror mine except I have replaced "Advantage Toggle" with "Roll Disadvantage". Perhaps this sheet should redesign those many ways of rolling and include the crit directly in the normal damage if advantage is selected.

Kaelev said: But wont removing the grey numbers mean there's no reason to have Adv/Disadv in the roll query? It'd just be roll normal and roll two? My group all agrees that rolling two can be disappointing as sometimes you end up with a really nice crit on the second roll, but they do not have advantage on the roll. So they'd much rather not see those crits go by. They rather make the conscious decision to roll with Adv/Disadv.  Sure, if that's what your group feels, that's fair enough. But I think there are a lot of people here who feel that the faff of having to specify advantage/disadvantage ahead of time, and the concomitant slowdown in play, more than outweighs the downside of seeing "what might have been"....

Lucian H. said: Sure, if that's what your group feels, that's fair enough. But I think there are a lot of people here who feel that the faff of having to specify advantage/disadvantage ahead of time, and the concomitant slowdown in play, more than outweighs the downside of seeing "what might have been".... His argument is that "If you just want to see everything then you should see everything" which is exactly the same I've put above. Currently we have a hybrid system. In actuality some people want to see everything and never have it filtered. That option is currently not present and perhaps this whole thing should be redesigned like I said above.

I'm not being hostile. I'm simply stating it in the simplest terms to get my point across. There are a number of people who want to roll twice and not have either number be greyed out for efficiency and aesthetics and contingency. Efficiency, because we don't need to remember to change the settings. Aesthetics, because having the number we want to use be greyed out is slightly confusing. Contingency, because having the second number is handy if you remember you would have had advantage or disdadvantage.

I think the point has been made now. There appears to be a non-trivial collection of users who don't want to have to specify whether they have (dis)advantage before they roll, but still see all the results. As things stand, the system supports those users, just not in an optimal way, visually speaking. I think it probably makes sense for us all to move on now that it's clear that the issue is understood by all involved. If Kryx wants to provide some further support for those of us who liked the old Roll 2 behaviour then great, if not, I don't think it's such a huge deal.

Issues seen so far while check fields - Weight of the equipment seems broken. No value appears for the weight of equipment on a new sheet even though there exists equipment with weight.

@Vanakoji: I can reproduce that. Armor weight seems to still work.. strange. Will investigate. To wrap up the earlier conversation: Changing what we have now will take a fair amount of time, though it could definitely be worth it. I will have to redesign the whole thing to be setup to handle advantage/disadvantage/normal roll/roll 2 with advantage but without fun stuff. The first 3 will parse stuff and modify, the last will try to leave everything as is. Perhaps I can revamp criticals to allow for houserules, but don't get any expectations there.

Kryx, thank you for the clarification on Concentration. So this is what I mean: - Drag Bless from SRD into an empty spell - Duration populates with "up to 1 min" and the "concentration" button next to it is highlighted. Visually, this works. It's "part of duration" in the sheet in a way, though it's not actually in the duration field, but next to it. During output, "up to 1 min" is output, but "Concentration, " is not there, and now I understand why. For output then, I think you have a choice: a) Output duration and prepend "Concentration, " if the concentration check-button is set or b) During import, leave "Concentration, " as part of the duration text field. Personally, I like a) better. It allows for filtering, and is visually neater than having "Concentration, " in the duration field, because it draws the eye to the "Concentration" button. That's an important piece of information to have, given how concentration works.

@Thorsten ah, thanks for reminding me. This completely fell off my radar. That checkbox shouldn't be visible at all. It should all be contained in the duration field which would then update the hidden checkbox for filtering purposes. I will edit that now.

Thanks for the response, Kryx!

Just to throw in my 2 cents. On the Grey Text Dis/Advantage rolls: I like it the way it is. Would prefer if the grey text was a bit darker, but this is still a style preference. And, if I understand the argument, that is what this argument amounts to. My answer to this would be; if you want both numbers black, then change the CSS of the sheet or use an addon like Stylish. I see no reason to change the roll behavior On the spell Concentration: I would prefer the see the the checkbox as it makes it stand out, rather then type in Concentration into the duration field. I would have to say I prefer Thorstens option A, or do the little dialog graphic the previous sheet had for concentration spells.

Will this push to replace the current 5e shaped sheet or will it get listed as a separate sheet?  I have lazy players and I am a lazy DM so wanted to know how much backup should be done with current sheets if any is needed.