Odd color choice for EVERYTHING now

I'm not sure whether this is the place to put this and whether it is related to the CSS changes, but I'm having problems on the character sheets Attributes and Abilities page with the icons vanishing on the Abilities when you try and mouse over them to use them.  Icons like the pencil to open up an Ability vanish just as you get to it.  It does seem to make a difference just what size you have the character sheet pulled out to, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.   While I'm at it, I'm having real difficulty trying to change the size of the character sheet.  Trying to use the corner arrow to expand or reduce the size of the sheet no longer works smoothly and the cursor seems to stick to it meaning that when you have it the size you want, it doesn't always let go, this used to happen occasionally, but it is happening all the time making resizing anything a nightmare. Again everything is being done on Chrome using the standard browser zoom feature.

Add to the mix, if not already noticed, when in the text editor, if you attempt to link a document, the text indicating the text and the hyperlink are near white and unreadable. Thanks! I also agree the pink it a little intense, btw. Thanks for working on this!

It's a rounded sans serif font that has no relation to Comic Sans. It's been the display font on half the site for a couple of years now. It's fine. The accessibility of pink is possibly an issue. But a font is just a matter of subjective tastes. I wanted to respond to this one. I am not targeting the original poster, as he is a good fella, but not everyone knows about font type issues. And for what it is worth, for me, the font change was not a big deal. But I stress the 'for me' part. The color change was a little more obnoxious to me, but growing up in the 80's, I figured my bride would love it. A few years ago, I was developing media for an organization and a co-worker let me know that font types definitely matter in more than an aesthetic manner if your goal is to communicate well to a broad group of people. Two examples: People with a form of dyslexia - I learned that there are some fonts that they have learned are far better, and cause less reading difficulty, for people coping with this problem. These fonts include 1. Open-Dyslexic · 2. Arial · 3. Comic Sans · 4. Verdana · 5. Tahoma · 6. Century Gothic, etc. ... . To learn more, here is a website about that challenge: <a href="https://www.dyslexia-reading-well.com/dyslexia-font.html" rel="nofollow">https://www.dyslexia-reading-well.com/dyslexia-font.html</a> . &nbsp;People with presbyopia ('older eyes') - many of us, as we age, experience changes that make reading smaller text or fonts that are 'bulbous' with a lot of cross-bars and near-proximity letter pieces much harder to read without having to increase magnification (which then affects all webpages, making you swap back &amp; forth in settings), etc. A LOT of us have that problem as we get older. What I am not saying is that I expect everyone and everything to accommodate everyone, so you don't need to rail at me about being some snowflake if that is your bent (not directed at OP). But, as someone who was accountable for increasing customer access and engagement, I thought I would point this out. Given how much I/we love to play, often spending hours in game, causing eye-strain is not a great business decision. That being said, I do appreciate font options (and wish there were more of them and a better text editor in general, as this one is very mid-90's). As a DM/GM, being able to make maps/handouts/tool-tips with fun graphics enhances the game. Note: I do usually include the text in a readable font below the graphic when I can. One of my best players is dyslexic, her characters are not. lol Have a great day!

David M. said: Algunillo, I don't think this is due to the recent site formatting changes. I replied to your specific post about this here . Thanks for your reply, I already replied to it. As I state there, I stopped playing for almost two years and restarted just two months ago, so I don't know if it is due to&nbsp; recent &nbsp;formatting changes, but it is definitely a problem of the site, not of me doing wrongly a process I've done easily a hundred times.

I have largely stepped out of this thread, but since I have have been quoted a number of times on this, I wanted to clarify my earlier statement about fonts, as I feel it is causing needless digression. Of course, font choice is not purely subjective. You would't use a display face for body copy. Some are objectively ornamental or intended as novelty faces. I should have been more clear in saying that in this very specific case, there is nothing objectively wrong with this font choice. It is readable, the kerning is fine. It is a professionally designed font from the Adobe Font collection. A particular user may not like it.&nbsp; They may have an aversion to its weight, rounded end caps, etc.&nbsp; They not feel like it serves well when used as the title on a horror game, for example. But that would be true of any font other than largely invisible ubiquitous fonts like Helvetica and similar. If I gave the impression that "font choices don't matter", mea culpa. I typed in haste. I have been a designer and worked in the print industry for over 35 years: Font choices matter. In this particular case, I feel that the Nunito family used for display is entirely justified (which is a subjective evaluation).

This whole debacle and the way it is handled is making me seriously consider moving to Foundry as well. Vote with my wallet, as the saying goes.

I really like the new design and can't really understand why people are upset with changes …

Kai B said: I really like the new design and can't really understand why people are upset with changes … Good for you. I am upset because pink on white is hard on my eyes, and I also detest the colour (along with mint green and other pastell colours). Also, the execution of these changes is quite astonishingly bad, since they end up with forms where there is white text on white backgrounds... And similar stuff. See above. Nor am I impressed with the response I got from Roll20's support when I contacted them.&nbsp;

Kai B said: I really like the new design and can't really understand why people are upset with changes … It's fair if you like the changes. However, for those who have vision problems or migraines this can be a problem as it comes down to accessibility rather than aesthetic. It isn't just bright pink on bright white causing issues either. Here is a great example of what their update did for inserting links to handouts: To be clear - There is text in that top box. The quickest solution would have been to just roll back the changes and revert to the previous version. Then they could have rolled out these changes a little at a time with testing, something I know for a fact they can do thanks to the number of surveys I've seen popping up regarding the potential changes with the layers in a game. Instead they pushed through an "aesthetic" choice and have more or less seemed to ignore the backlash to follow despite there being legitimate issues with vision and migraine affected users.

The pink font is awful.&nbsp;

Has the hue of pink changed or are my retinas developing a callous? It's still somewhat painful to look at and hard to focus on. And, IMO, ugly. I'm just glad that the actual game-space isn't that much affected or some of my players would quit. Creating handouts that are more than just text is still problematic, but fortunately for me the design work for my current game is complete; it's just harder now to add tweaks or afterthoughts.

Kai B said: I really like the new design and can't really understand why people are upset with changes … It's not just a matter of taste. This color combination causes many people to experience actual, physical pain. Not exaggerating,&nbsp; kidding or using hyperbole; the pink on white actually hurts.

" It's Typesetting the User's Game Titles, this font-and-color choice is too extreme, too branded, too niche, it's incompatible." Gold, this whole thread is really well explained. Thanks for the deep dive. That's how I feel as well. It's surprisingly off-putting when trying to get in the mood for a game to see the cotton candy-land like font and color.

Adam Caramon said: I doubt that is the issue.&nbsp; More likely rolling back would be looked at as an admission that this wasn't tested enough before being implemented and no one wants to be responsible for such an admission. -Adam I never understood that mentality. It was a mistake, everyone knows that it's a mistake, and denying it makes everyone, from the CEO to the newest intern look bad. Denial of responsibility is childish.

Rick A. said: Adam Caramon said: I doubt that is the issue.&nbsp; More likely rolling back would be looked at as an admission that this wasn't tested enough before being implemented and no one wants to be responsible for such an admission. -Adam I never understood that mentality. It was a mistake, everyone knows that it's a mistake, and denying it makes everyone, from the CEO to the newest intern look bad. Denial of responsibility is childish. Especially when there's absolutely no upside to the version that's current now, only downsides: an appearance that most people don't like but especially, lots of functionality broken. It is very clear that Roll 20 right now is worse than it was before this change with no good side. Only cons, no pros. I truly do not understand the motivation for not reverting to when it was better, and not caring about alienating your users.

This is from the bug section of the forum: This is from the more accessible global forum page: One topic missing. Weird algorithm. I guess some topics better not attract attention.

I guess making this topic invisible on the main forum page was the highest priority compared to actually addressing the problem.

Mike Donovan said: I guess making this topic invisible on the main forum page was the highest priority compared to actually addressing the problem. This is just so sad. That they would sink so low.&nbsp;

Mike Donovan said: I guess making this topic invisible on the main forum page was the highest priority compared to actually addressing the problem. Wow. The answer to getting too many complaints is to hide the complaints? Stick their fingers in their ears and yell "Nah! Nah! Na-nah! Nah! I can't hear you!" ? Mission accomplished. I'm done complaining. It's obvious that no one with authority is listening.

Frank K. said: Mike Donovan said: I guess making this topic invisible on the main forum page was the highest priority compared to actually addressing the problem. This is just so sad. That they would sink so low.&nbsp; &lt;shrug&gt; Is what they do for all the forum topics they want to pretend don’t exist. I will not be renewing my subscription when it runs out. &nbsp;Will be either moving to Foundry or in-person. &nbsp;It seems like such a silly reason after all the actual game breaking bugs and annoyances I’ve put up with over the past year or two, but the way it was rolled out and response has just cemented how much they just don’t care about the user experience, about testing, or quality, or communication. &nbsp;I’ve realized that I just don’t trust them with my data and and have gotten to the point where I’m willing do do a lot of work and spend s bunch of money just so i can stop giving any to roll20.

Mike Donovan said: I guess making this topic invisible on the main forum page was the highest priority compared to actually addressing the problem. This thread was not specifically targeted for the "hiding the thread until you enter the forum" issue - its how the forum treats all threads that are older than a certain number of days.&nbsp; Not sure why the developers made this decision in the past, but it has been the behavior of the forums for a while now. -Adam

Drespar said: Hey folks, Wanted to jump in here to say that we are still monitoring this thread and reviewing it for feedback. As for the thread not showing up at the top level-- this is due to an automated forum feature based on the age of the thread. To circumvent this I am going to go ahead and sticky this thread. After we have addressed more of the feedback the thread will be unstickied once again. In that same vein, just to say it out loud as well, I am going to unsticky the Dark Mode for VTT thread as by and large conversation in that thread has slowed considerably. This will also help keep the number of stickied threads from getting too large. Lastly,&nbsp; we appreciate the feedback and information folks have provided so far, but&nbsp; as a general reminder to please review our Code of Conduct before posting. You say you are monitoring the thread and reviewing it for feedback, but it is clear you’re not listening. Could you at least explain why you haven’t reverted those dreadful changes right away? Why you insist on letting the users who still remain subscribed here live with those issues? How can you say you’re monitoring when you don’t even try to answer the most basic of questions that are being shouted on this thread?

I'm still getting a ton of white-on-white in my games. I'm still getting my fucking retinae raped by this clashing color combination. Whenever I look at Roll20 and then look at a white wall, I'm seeing greenish spots where the hot pink buttons are. You're literally burning out my photoreceptors. I'm rather bothered that this new change hasn't been made optional in the test server.&nbsp;

Mike Donovan said: Drespar said: Hey folks, Wanted to jump in here to say that we are still monitoring this thread and reviewing it for feedback. As for the thread not showing up at the top level-- this is due to an automated forum feature based on the age of the thread. To circumvent this I am going to go ahead and sticky this thread. After we have addressed more of the feedback the thread will be unstickied once again. In that same vein, just to say it out loud as well, I am going to unsticky the Dark Mode for VTT thread as by and large conversation in that thread has slowed considerably. This will also help keep the number of stickied threads from getting too large. Lastly,&nbsp; we appreciate the feedback and information folks have provided so far, but&nbsp; as a general reminder to please review our Code of Conduct before posting. You say you are monitoring the thread and reviewing it for feedback, but it is clear you’re not listening. Could you at least explain why you haven’t reverted those dreadful changes right away? Why you insist on letting the users who still remain subscribed here live with those issues? How can you say you’re monitoring when you don’t even try to answer the most basic of questions that are being shouted on this thread? Don't waste your breath. Roll20 monitors these threads sporadically at best and rarely replies directly to user queries. Popping in with a bland, general, content-light post designed to provide the appearance of listening without its actual substance is kind of their M.O. As is pretending their users' pain points and very understandable frustration ... just don't exist.

I finally put my finger on what this place reminds me of, since the changes: I can now literally smell this website...

While you are at it fixing CSS Bugs, how about this one: Appearing on the Game Page when using Roll20 in GERMAN! Not sure if this goes for other languages, too!

" we are still monitoring this thread and reviewing it for feedback." That does not make us feel any better.&nbsp;

They even removed the option to pick a font color in this editor here...

&nbsp;However, for those who have vision problems or migraines this can be a problem as it comes down to accessibility rather than aesthetic. It isn't just bright pink on bright white causing issues either. Here is a great example of what their update did for inserting links to handouts: To be clear - There is text in that top box. The quickest solution would have been to just roll back the changes and revert to the previous version. Then they could have rolled out these changes a little at a time with testing, something I know for a fact they can do thanks to the number of surveys I've seen popping up regarding the potential changes with the layers in a game. Instead they pushed through an "aesthetic" choice and have more or less seemed to ignore the backlash to follow despite there being legitimate issues with vision and migraine affected users. It's good that roll20 is still monitoring this thread. Any chance of getting a fix for this (and the white-on-white pulldowns) before the week is out?&nbsp; It's infuriating to edit handout links, which is something I do frequently as a gamemaster and a player who keeps an in-game journal. I thought the rapid turnaround on some of the fixes was a sign that the usual roll20 slow crawl might be speeding up, but we're back to waiting way too long for simple improvements and bug fixes, which really shouldn't be the norm around here, but has been for nearly a decade. Some basic features have taken years, or are still pending.&nbsp; Do you realize you have actual competitors now? I swear if there was a race between a snail, a sloth, a tortoise, a sentient stream of molasses, a glacier, and the roll20 devs, I wouldn't bet on roll20 to place in the top 3, and I'd have my doubts they would make the top 5. Sorry to vent on the forums yet again.&nbsp; I've deleted several versions of this gripe over the last few days before hitting that glaring pink submit button, but the frustration is taking its toll. Fix your mistakes and do better in the future.&nbsp;&nbsp;

The new font is utterly horrific too.&nbsp;

Not sure if this has been mentioned previously, but when editing a post in the forums, the "Style" selector drop down now looks like this:

If you EDIT a Post here in the forum it looks like this, also the "Insert Image" dialog is transparent. BUT if you send someone a PM here in the forum, the pinkish outline is still there as is in the "Edit Post" editor, but at least the editor there WORKS... (pinkish outlines / hovering / Pinkt Buttons white Font when pressed)... But as it is at the moment - and since nothing will change anyway - I'm tired of saying anything else on the subject! In fact, one of the competitors is already smiling at me all the time and since the last changes here I will give in to it. Actually a pity, because I was very happy with Roll20 all the time. I let my PRO subscription still exist, but will NOT extend it further! There are too many things wrong or just plain annoying! timmaugh said: Not sure if this has been mentioned previously, but when editing a post in the forums, the "Style" selector drop down now looks like this:

I just cannot understand how upsetting long time customers over a design choice, which adds zero functionality to the platform makes any sense. It's OK to admit you made a mistake and roll it back. It's not OK to try and wait us out. We won't be here long enough for that to happen. Or maybe you don't care and have planned for some losses? Either way that makes no sense from a business standpoint either. Especially when it's all caused over a color.

I have to say that the new design hurts my eyes (not an expression), it really gives me headaches and makes evrything difficult to read for my 50 years old eyes......

roll20 is and always has been an absolute dissapointment brought forward only by its community. I fucking hate how they treat the people they depend on and as things are clear not to change due to a company policy of "weathering out the storm" rather than addressing any of its causes, i look forward to seeing this website fade into irrelevance. Foundry, here i come.

And yet ANOTHER contrast issue! The Close Button for character sheets / handouts is NOT VISIBLE! If you think it cannot get worse...

Maxtech said: roll20 is and always has been an absolute dissapointment brought forward only by its community. I fucking hate how they treat the people they depend on and as things are clear not to change due to a company policy of "weathering out the storm" rather than addressing any of its causes, i look forward to seeing this website fade into irrelevance. Foundry, here i come. Weathering the storm has always worked; it will work this time.&nbsp; People are upset about it and threaten to move to another VTT; however, they will not because they have vested too much time/money/energy into it.&nbsp; Its human nature to resist change so they will remain here with a VTT they know and are comfortable with.&nbsp; Sure there will be the small number that may jump ship, but most will return and those that don't will be replaced by others quick enough.&nbsp; Roll20 knows this so they will just wait for the dust to settle.&nbsp; They will not change their ways until they see a mass migration leave and not return. Just my 2 cents on it.

Rich H. said: Maxtech said: roll20 is and always has been an absolute dissapointment brought forward only by its community. I fucking hate how they treat the people they depend on and as things are clear not to change due to a company policy of "weathering out the storm" rather than addressing any of its causes, i look forward to seeing this website fade into irrelevance. Foundry, here i come. Weathering the storm has always worked; it will work this time.&nbsp; People are upset about it and threaten to move to another VTT; however, they will not because they have vested too much time/money/energy into it.&nbsp; Its human nature to resist change so they will remain here with a VTT they know and are comfortable with.&nbsp; Sure there will be the small number that may jump ship, but most will return and those that don't will be replaced by others quick enough.&nbsp; Roll20 knows this so they will just wait for the dust to settle.&nbsp; They will not change their ways until they see a mass migration leave and not return. Just my 2 cents on it. I think you're wrong there sir. There is more value elsewhere for far less these days. Roll20 is definitely not the most innovative any longer. But hey, we have pink hyperlinks!

TheMarkus1204 said: And yet ANOTHER contrast issue! The Close Button for character sheets / handouts is NOT VISIBLE! Mine looks like this in chrome, I don't think I'm using any plug-ins enabled: Are you using something that might affect the style or look of the page?

The only extension I use is Stylus and only for the forums here... even if stylus is turned off, you can barely see the "X" Button on the top right... I really don't understand why they won't just rollback those CSS changes for VTT (this would fix control-Elements in front of character Sheets / PDF as well!) and then add them little by little... MysterX said: TheMarkus1204 said: And yet ANOTHER contrast issue! The Close Button for character sheets / handouts is NOT VISIBLE! Mine looks like this in chrome, I don't think I'm using any plug-ins enabled: Are you using something that might affect the style or look of the page?