A New Light - Bug Thread - Updated Dynamic Lighting and Fog of War

Check this out; if you move tokens on ANOTHER MAP ENTIRELY it reveals on whatever map the players currently are on. I don't have a screenshot I have a video! <a href="https://twitter.com/theseldonplan/status/1248473304945414145" rel="nofollow">https://twitter.com/theseldonplan/status/1248473304945414145</a>

Got to say, for the first time I've put this to use and used it on my maps, it was not &nbsp;more performant. Several crashes on a not so large map, but there were server problems this evening. Not sure if they got solved, but this was the worst Roll20 night I've had in a while as a DM. I ended up turning off the new Dynamic Lighting and went back to the old Advanced Fog of War and things started working fine again. Slight slowness only and no more crashes. I'm not sold on this new lighting model with explorer mode on being more performant than just the Advanced Fog of War, it was just unusable until I set it back to the legacy one. My two cents worth of experience. I'm hoping it was just the server issue, but I'm doubtful.

Kalagari said: Nicholas said: Kalagari said: Kalagari said: Hello, Another thing I have noticed is that the tokens I have set up to represent torches, on the lighting layer, do not have produce their light unless you move the token around. It's as if the lighting only kicks in for the first time when you "drop" the token. Adding pictures to demonstrate the issues I am experiencing. When I initially load the map: After I move the light(yellow dot towards the bottom left): Hey Kalagari -&nbsp; Just to check, were these tokens something you already had set up for legacy lighting and then switched over? Also, would you mind providing me the name of the game that this occurred with please? Thank you!&nbsp;&nbsp; Hello Nicholas, This was set up ahead of time as part of the Princes of the Apocalypse module I purchased. I then went in and added the settings for the new lighting system, for this page. link to the game:&nbsp; <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/4437899/pota" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/4437899/pota</a> I am also curious if tokens in purchased modules will be updated to the new lighting system or if I will need to go in and update each and every map myself. Thanks, Kal &nbsp; I am having this same issue, on a game I already had which is a purchased adventure. The game is <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6061203/co-late-night-d-and-d" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6061203/co-late-night-d-and-d</a>

Is it okay to just post a link to the pro forum thread as my issue still persists (verified it just minutes ago)?

Lots of crashes for all players, My dark vision players would lose all sight when they moved

Hi, I've a bug while using the new feature of dynamic light. The situation is: all the map is covered by fog of war, and the explorer mode is enabled: when a character cross the map, i expect that fog of war in this part of the map disapear, also when the character move away (and only the map remain visible, but darkest). instead, when it leaves, the fog of war returns and the explored part turns complitely black. have you some ideas about this? thank you all

Luckily for me I managed to get the legacy one working again (but it did still break the token I had for one of my monsters and I had to reupload it and manually re-place ALL my monsters for all the floors!) So I have some additional problems: 1) This should not have been made public before feature parity. It breaks too many other things for no clear benefit. 2) It causes map load times to take noticeably longer, and this makes me highly suspect that my players - some of whom use very old computers - will not be able to play at all with the new system (which seems easy to believe when even with my new computer, I have to wait 15+ seconds for it to load. 3) When changing the size of a map with the new lighting, it re-loads the page. Normal dynamic lighting does not require this. It's ludicrous. Frankly, all told, I think you should just update the legacy version instead. Give it a few bugfixes and add a separate "Emits Light" section for it and frankly, we'll be gold.

I loved this new update, however I see two problems. with the tokens emitting light you see a circle around black, it seems that the opacity map is not working properly. you have disabled "update only on release" and it is a problem, because my players can take their token to see the whole map without me knowing it, the "explorer mode" function should be disabled when the token is "floating" or moving, it would be nice if the "explorer mode" only updates on release and not while it is moving.&nbsp;

In no way should you take out the old lighting system, it works fine... Please just keep it in. New lighting system is too broken to even call a beta. These early alpha features of the new light are, ok but I would not pay for it if it was the only way.&nbsp;

I had the exact same issue. I have the updated dynamic lighting turned off in my game because it didn't work at all - several of the issues discussed here were present. One observation, that may be helpful to you Nicholas, is that that exact situation (where vision was blocked only for a space in front of the token, but not at the edges, as in the picture) only happened on long straight lines. If you instead make a long straight line by connecting several smaller lines, that issue would not occur. This created other issues (where tokens could sometimes see through the line connections), but it may illuminate what aspect of the code is creating the first issue. Nicholas said: TetNak said: I have yet to see a map where the light didn't bleed through significantly. I am making a simple square/rectangle around the token just to test. This is bizarre. The image below is on the dynamic layer layer. The token can see through the barrier at angles.&nbsp; Hey&nbsp;TetNak -&nbsp; Would you mind providing me a link to the game in question, please? Thank you! :)

I had a player join my campaign to test it out, and they claimed they could see everything as if there was no dynamic lighting at all and the whole page was visible. (Game:&nbsp; <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6754682/the-town-of-kaotri" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6754682/the-town-of-kaotri</a> &nbsp;, second map ) Sadly I don't have their specs, and after forcefully disabling the new one and re-enabling it worked, but still very concerning.&nbsp; The biggest concern, regardless of the sometimes bugs, is the lack of "Update on Drop" functionality. It allows players to explore an entire map with explorers mode saving everything, without the GM/DM having any clue.&nbsp; Performance is way better so far than the old Advance fog of war + Dynamic lighting, so big props to that, moving to the new API method was great, so I understand that with an entirely new system, it's hard to get exact feature parody with the original.&nbsp;

There is a bug in the old lighting system that I would like to mention so that you dont have it in the new system either. Advanced Fog of War Only reveals things that a token can see from its own light. This means that a token could be looking at an area that is lit by torchlight, and yet it does not reveal the area on the map.

I'm running a windows 7 machine with Chrome that is a little older (only 6GB of RAM).&nbsp; The previous dynamic lighting works lag-lessly and perfectly, the legacy Advanced Fog of War has a tiny bit of stutter.&nbsp; The new system is totally unplayable and slow, what I have noticed though is that it has to do with the size of the map.&nbsp; On a small map (say 12 by 15) even with many lighting features it's usuable, on a big map (40x40) I can't really move tokens even if 2 tokens are generating light.&nbsp; The size of the map seems to not influence the response of the legacy advanced fog of war though.&nbsp;&nbsp;

Using legacy system, I've had two different players in the same game not be able to see certain monster tokens when the other players could see them. Everything was as it should be. Dragged fresh monsters from compendium onto the map.... Same issue. Certain monsters were fine but all orcs were invisible to one player only, and a home made token was invisible to one other player. With the monsters they could see, the token light settings were EXACTLY the same and everything was on token layer.&nbsp; Please can you make sure this update is not effecting legacy light and token settings. Can you give me a solution to this as literally no setting would let the player see the tokens, even with dynamic lighting turned off.&nbsp;

When I enable the new Dynamic Lighting, either the players see the entire map when "Explorer Mode" is on, or they see absolutely nothing without it.&nbsp; Either my dynamic lighting barriers, and vision distances are ignored, or they see nothing at all.&nbsp; Just a black screen.&nbsp; I have tried giving the tokens night-vision, and having them emit light and low-light.&nbsp; What am I doing wrong?

Night vision is not working as it should. Description in screenshot.

I'm on a Mac, I use Safari. With the new update, the moment I turn Dynamic Lighting on, the tokens can't see anything anymore. Am I the only person having this problem?? My page settings: There are no light sources available on this map, characters need their darkvision: Token settings for one of my players:&nbsp; But this is what happens when I use Control-L

I know Safari is not officially supported, but it has been mostly functional, and I use both Chrome (as GM) and Safari (in player mode).&nbsp; I'm having the same experience as Halie S on Safari with the updated DL: black page, no visibility of anything other than the player's own token, regardless of settings.

Chad W. said: In no way should you take out the old lighting system, it works fine... Please just keep it in. New lighting system is too broken to even call a beta. These early alpha features of the new light are, ok but I would not pay for it if it was the only way.&nbsp; I couldnt agree more.&nbsp; It was a fine system.&nbsp; It was buggy, but it had more features than the new system.&nbsp; It feels like its not even remotely thought through.&nbsp; I'm incredible disappointed.

Bob P. said: I warned you Roll20 on the Pro Forum not to launch this to the public until you had more time to debug this system.&nbsp; You had delayed once and I commended you on that but you really didn't make any marked improvements before you launched on the 8th.&nbsp; And to find that this "Update", although Opt-In, still broke things that were not related to it, is unbelievable.&nbsp; And I never got an answer regarding whether players who have mediocre video cards will not work once we "Are Required" to switch of the the new Buggy Vision System?&nbsp; If this system is going to require everyone to have I9 Processors, Generation 15 Video Cards, 1 GB Bandwidth for Internet, and 64 GB of Ram, I will be done.&nbsp; I lived thru last year's debacle of "Updated" AFOW that to date, has never been fixed.&nbsp; Yeah, you threw me a bone with a Subscription Credit but if my players can't play, what is the point.&nbsp; I think it is time that Nolan T. Jones Address the User Base and let us know what will be done to reduce the shortcomings of this platform.&nbsp; I have made a large investment in purchases as well as an even larger investment in time to create my adventures, but, if this is what I have to look forward to, I must consider finding another route to run my D&amp;D 5E games.&nbsp; I am currently running both online and, when the quarantine is over, IRL, and have been using Roll20.&nbsp; I have brought quite a few people to D&amp;D 5E as well as Roll20 and I enjoy that the most.&nbsp; But if I am handcuffed and the functionality that I pay for is reduced or unplayable, what am I paying for?&nbsp; Sorry for the Rant but I saw this coming and it has been a train wreck just like last year.&nbsp; I thought you had learned something but obviously not. I am in the same boat.&nbsp; I buy books through roll20 so that my players can use them in compendium.&nbsp; I have been a pro member for that reason entirely.&nbsp; Dont roll out buggy features.&nbsp; I even used roll20 IRL.&nbsp; Things like this make me really upset as a long time pro user.

Man, I was all optimistic that this new dynamic lighting feature was going to fix all the issues with the old three-tier system, but I am super unimpressed right now.&nbsp; I have a very high-end PC, with an AMD Ryzen 7 2700X and an NVidia GeForce RTX 2070 Super.&nbsp; The old Dynamic Lighting system worked great, but if I tried to enable Advanced Fog of War it would get pretty laggy. No problem! I juust kept AFOW off.&nbsp; I want to use it, but I'd rather be able to play. The new system, however, has a lot of bugs that really should have been worked out before this ever saw the light of day outside of the development environmment: Performance Issues: I converted one of my maps to the new system, and even with Explorer Mode turned off, my CPU spikes to 100% whenever a token moves, and if I &nbsp;am trying to move the token, it gets so laggy that the token legitimately snaps back to its starting location because the server does not receive updates in a timely manner. I did double check that I have WebGL enabled (I do).&nbsp; &nbsp; The performance hits are bad enough that I would genuinely rather not use Dynamic Lighting at all than attempt to use this feature.&nbsp; Thankfully I can still use the Legacy mode (for now).&nbsp; However ... No-Dynamic Lighting Doesn't Work: When we disabled dynamic lighting (both the new feature and the legacy checkbox) on a map, players could not see anything on the map. The map was pitch black. We ensured FOW and AFOW were disabled; didn't matter.&nbsp; I have not yet attempted to create a new game with no dynamic lighting whatsoever, but I am gravely concerned for what happens when the legacy mode option goes away.&nbsp; This needs to be fixed first, because right now Roll20 is literally unusable with Dynamic Lighting disabled, as far as I can tell.

How was this cleared for release???

No Screen dumps or any console logs, but I just took the free Phandelver release, set up a single player character, plopped them down in the starting area, activated the "Updated" dynamic lighting and set explorer mode on.&nbsp; On the token, set vision, night vision, 60 ft. and then go.&nbsp; I was signed in as my DM account, PRO, and had the map up.&nbsp; I started Task Manager on the PC to see resource usage.&nbsp; Running in Firefox on that session.&nbsp; On the same computer, I launched Chrome, with WebGL active, and logged in with my test player account.&nbsp; Started the game on that session and began to move my token about.&nbsp; In the entry section it was pegging the GPU at 50%.&nbsp; CPU would jump up to 50, down to 30, 20 etc.&nbsp; As the gm, I moved the player past the barrier for exploration of the rest of the map.&nbsp; Following the lower right corridors, as I moved the player token, the GPU spiked at 100% and my GM session was locked up.&nbsp; I got the yellow bar saying a webpage is taking too long.&nbsp; Was able to continue to move on the player session and when I exited that session and shut down the browser, the GPU was still spiked.&nbsp; CPU never really got above 60%.&nbsp; I could intermittently click options on the GM session and was able to finally able to exit the game and then shut down the browser.&nbsp; It seems to me that this should be a pretty easy task that the Devs could perform to start testing and debugging what is going on to spike the processor like that.&nbsp; I would say it has alot to do with those Leaks that you see when you go past joint sections.&nbsp; I am a test engineer and I know the value of supplying as much info to the Developer on issues you create.&nbsp; What I have listed above should be fairly easy to follow.&nbsp; I surely hope you find a way to fix this system to it doesn't break it for everyone and if this new system is going to require High-end Processing power, I am fine but my players are screwed.&nbsp; And in that case, I will be moving on to other platforms that will allow me to bring a fun and engaging experience to my players.

Alrighty then. I am really looking forward to this updated feature. When it WORKS. This should not have been released yet, except to a few people to test on willing subjects. THE LAG.&nbsp; My god.&nbsp; The.&nbsp; Lag. All of my players and myself saw computer use spike to max at moving a single token (one that didn't have vision or lighting itself). Strange behavior that has already been well reported in this forum. But you need another vote on the 'continue to develop the alpha version and make it playable before re-release' category. If you replace the current lighting with this function the way it uses resources and behaves now, you will lose subscribers.&nbsp; Don't do it.&nbsp; I love Roll20, have invested a lot here.

Two comments: 1.&nbsp; Is there any API access to this as I like that for the prior version I could create a torch with the token api. 2.&nbsp; Old version of dynamic lighting stopped functioning for players and using the cntrl L showed it as an issue on my end as well.&nbsp; Switched to the new version and it worked but the old I thought was still going to be supported.

I like how the new feature works, it's much clearer than before, and love that you can set night vision on characters. Two suggestions to improve that feature further: include a setting to mark night vision as dim light, to support the very common Darkvision ability in D&amp;D 5e. Also, being able to select a different color for the "light" from darkvision would make it a lot easier for the DM to describe what each character sees.

Nicholas said: Hey DM - For your report here , would you mind providing me a link to the game in which you reproduced this, please? Thanks in advance for your patience and assistance! Hi, here's the campaign: <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6514840/dm-storm-kings-thunder" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6514840/dm-storm-kings-thunder</a> The page map is the one I called "bugged" ...&nbsp; I deleted the previuos one and made this one which has similar problems. Regards R

All players were WebGL compatible. Caused instantaneous page lock-up. scrambled to turn the legacy settings on. big oof. It worked for like a little bit, then locked up every time we refreshed or re-opened

Hi, forgive me if this has been answered, but what is the plan to port over purchased adventures? I own Descent into Avernus, and there's a crazy amount of content to switch over manually. Thanks.

I believe that upthread there was mention that once the UDL is formally adopted and the old one phased out, Users will not have to do anything manually. My guess is that this will not be any time soon, though. There's a long issue list to get through.

What you were trying to do: I made a test game to try and test out the new dynamic lighting. I use the d20 5e character sheet and put in some dynamic lighting barriers. I gave one token darkvision 60 feet and another token emitting light 20 bright and 20 dim, like a torch in 5e. Dark vision Torch I was then just playing around a map to try and test it it out. What happened: &nbsp;(Screen shots are useful here!) It appears as though the token set to emit light was actually showing no light and taking away light/vision from the other token. In this case the token labeled Human Mage is the emitting light and the gnome rogue is set to darkvision. Screen Shot from GM point of view Control L from character with torch point of view. Control L with darkvision character point of view: Steps to Reproduce: Open up the game and move token out for the two characters. Browser &amp; OS info: Chrome Book Is WebGL supported by your browser? Please visit&nbsp; <a href="https://webglreport.com/" rel="nofollow">https://webglreport.com/</a> &nbsp;and copy/paste the WebGL1 report from there. I don't understand. Game Link: &nbsp;(The URL when you're looking at your Game Details page) <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6858268/dynamic-lighting-test" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6858268/dynamic-lighting-test</a> Game Settings Was anything changed from default? The only thing I changed was turning on dynamic lighting. I did play around a bit with explorer mode and daylight mode. Map Settings Are you using Legacy or Updated?-Updated Were you using Explorer Mode or not? Were you using Daylight Mode or not? Token Settings What kinds of light and vision were utilized on tokens? (bright light, low light, night vision, regular vision) Both tokens have vision:on One token has emits bright light:on 20 and emits low light 20. The other token has nightvision:on &nbsp;60 ft Do you have Hardware Acceleration turned On or Off in your browser or system: Again, I don't understand this question.

Bug Report Template What you were trying to do: Run a small-scale experiment with 4 players to test if the updated lighting was feasible for their computer systems. What happened: &nbsp;(Screen shots are useful here!) Worked fine for me before game in setting up map.&nbsp; Once session testing started, worked fine for the players, but brought my computer (as the GM) to its knees whenever a player moved their token.&nbsp; Players were able to act normally, mine maxed out GPU usage to the point where I was unable to perform any actions at all in roll20 or Windows until about 10 seconds after all players stopped all movement.&nbsp; Attempted to use Firefox browser as alternative, encountered same issue.&nbsp; While using Ctrl-L to limit view to a single character's perspective, no issues whatsoever, so issue may stem from system attempting to render changes to multiple characters simultaneously for GM view. Steps to Reproduce: Have four players with tokens that have vision enabled move tokens on a map while you are in GM mode. Browser &amp; OS info: Chrome v80.0.3987.163, Windows 10 64-bit Intel Core i7-6820 HK CPU @ 2.70 GHz 32 GB RAM NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070 Is WebGL supported by your browser? Please visit&nbsp; <a href="https://webglreport.com/" rel="nofollow">https://webglreport.com/</a> &nbsp;and copy/paste the WebGL1 report from there. Platform: Win32 Browser User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/80.0.3987.163 Safari/537.36 Context Name: webgl GL Version: WebGL 1.0 (OpenGL ES 2.0 Chromium) Shading Language Version: WebGL GLSL ES 1.0 (OpenGL ES GLSL ES 1.0 Chromium) Vendor: WebKit Renderer: WebKit WebGL Unmasked Vendor: Google Inc. Unmasked Renderer: ANGLE (Intel(R) HD Graphics 530 Direct3D11 vs_5_0 ps_5_0) Antialiasing: Available ANGLE: Yes, D3D11 Major Performance Caveat: No Vertex Shader Max Vertex Attributes: 16 Max Vertex Uniform Vectors: 4096 Max Vertex Texture Image Units: 16 Max Varying Vectors: 30 Best float precision: [-2 127 , 2 127 ] (23) Transform Feedback Coming in&nbsp; WebGL 2 Rasterizer Aliased Line Width Range: [1, 1] Aliased Point Size Range: [1, 1024] Fragment Shader Max Fragment Uniform Vectors: 1024 Max Texture Image Units: 16 float/int precision: highp/highp Best float precision: [-2 127 , 2 127 ] (23) Framebuffer Max Color Buffers: 8 RGBA Bits: [8, 8, 8, 8] Depth / Stencil Bits: [24, 8] Max Render Buffer Size: 16384 Max Viewport Dimensions: [32767, 32767] Textures Max Texture Size: 16384 Max Cube Map Texture Size: 16384 Max Combined Texture Image Units: 32 Max Anisotropy: 16 Uniform Buffers Coming in&nbsp; WebGL 2 Supported Extensions: ANGLE_instanced_arrays EXT_blend_minmax EXT_color_buffer_half_float EXT_disjoint_timer_query EXT_float_blend EXT_frag_depth EXT_shader_texture_lod EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic WEBKIT_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic EXT_sRGB KHR_parallel_shader_compile OES_element_index_uint OES_fbo_render_mipmap OES_standard_derivatives OES_texture_float OES_texture_float_linear OES_texture_half_float OES_texture_half_float_linear OES_vertex_array_object WEBGL_color_buffer_float WEBGL_compressed_texture_s3tc WEBKIT_WEBGL_compressed_texture_s3tc WEBGL_compressed_texture_s3tc_srgb WEBGL_debug_renderer_info WEBGL_debug_shaders WEBGL_depth_texture WEBKIT_WEBGL_depth_texture WEBGL_draw_buffers WEBGL_lose_context WEBKIT_WEBGL_lose_context Game Link: &nbsp;(The URL when you're looking at your Game Details page) <a href="https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6012143/itty-bitty-monster-committee" rel="nofollow">https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/6012143/itty-bitty-monster-committee</a> Game Settings Was anything changed from default? Pathfinder by roll20 Character Sheets in use Map Settings Are you using Legacy or Updated? - Attempted to use Updated Were you using Explorer Mode or not? - Attempted to use Explorer Mode Were you using Daylight Mode or not? - Not using Daylight Mode Token Settings What kinds of light and vision were utilized on tokens?&nbsp; (bright light, low light, night vision, regular vision) 3 player character tokens (Migla, No, and Creggec) have both Vision and Night Vision (60 feet) enabled 1 player has an additional token under their control (Murmur) that also has both Vision and Night Vision (60 feet) enabled 1 player token (Shadebrush) has Vision but not Night Vision, and is emitting 5 feet of bright light and 15 feet of low light. Do you have Hardware Acceleration turned On or Off in your browser or system: Hardware Acceleration is turned on in Chrome

Just a heads up, the Legacy lighting completely ruined my game today by constantly freezing their screens because of how slow it makes their computers. If you make the new Legacy lighting the permanent only version I'll end my subscription because I won't be able to play.&nbsp;

Just an add-ons to the problem list and funny things that might help explain some of the behaviour. Some of it may or maynot be DL related. :) Hardware acceleration from Nvidia graphics card makes the game crash - turned off, no problem, just massive lag The colour of the Explorer mode is very hard to see in DOTMM Think its cool that tokens with nightvision shows where light sources ends. That makes it possible for a shadow monk to see where there is shadows. The bleeding trough the wall is massive, and sometimes the PC can make sections of the dungeon visible, and you have no way to reset the area because the tools is tired to the old system.&nbsp; Just massive lag when exploremode is active. My honest guess is the server capacity/PC capacity ratio. Massive oneway lag. When GM moves tokens it response quickly on the player PC, When the players move tokens the GM lags a lot Seems like the "servers" spins down when VTT is not used for a while. Everything lags when i get back to the VTT after making dinner, but after I "activated all tokens not much lag. just my 2 cent Keep at it!!! I love roll20.

I cant describe the problem propery but it seems the dynamic lighting isnt mapping to the area an is effectively shrinking the dynamic lighting map along the horzontal axis gm view and ctrl +L view below&nbsp; the game name is tomb of Annihilation&nbsp;

Xeno said: The colour of the Explorer mode is very hard to see in DOTMM Apart from all the technical problems, this was the thing that annoyed me the most.&nbsp; I wasn't playing DotMM, but my map did have grey floors, which made it very difficult (if not impossible) to tell the difference between normal viewing, and the desaturated explorer mode.&nbsp; The advanced old fog of war would put a shadow over the parts of the map that were not currently in view, which made it much easier to distinguish.

further to the above issue I now have the problem that torch light overruns night vision (example below) apologies guys but I'm very new to the system with no coding knowledge so this change has been causing me major headaches, how can I revert to the legascy system of dynamic lighting?&nbsp;&nbsp;